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Netflix Posted Biggest-Ever Profit in 2018 and Paid $0 in Income Taxes

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Re: Netflix Posted Biggest-Ever Profit in 2018 and Paid $0 in Income Taxes

#281

Post by AlexTWithBeard »

otachack wrote: post #46
driverdan wrote: post #34

Rather than being outraged at the headline, what are the actual details? Why were they able to pay no taxes? Was it due to carried losses or something like that? Anyone mad at a company for not pay taxes is misdirecting their anger. Companies follow the law. If you don't like the law elect different politicians. Don't get mad at companies that follow the law.

It's not that simple. Companies lobby to keep, even coerce, laws that benefit them and allow these sorts of things to happen. What is the common person, or collection of persons, supposed to do when they are against that kind of force? I believe one way is to actually be involved in politics and get into the seats that govern and make the laws. But it's easier said than done.

It indeed may be not that simple, but I think the key point of the driverdan's message is: could the article please have provided a little bit more actual detail in addition to rage and emotions?

Re: Netflix Posted Biggest-Ever Profit in 2018 and Paid $0 in Income Taxes

#282

Post by [deleted] »

undecisive wrote: post #204
AlexB138 wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The answer is to outlaw lobbyists, it would fix a lot of problems. That, and enact term limits for Congress. That will fix even more. When you think there are simple answers to big problems it's generally because you don't actually understand the problem. How would you outlaw lobbyists? Setting aside the fact that it would be unconstitutional, do you think it should be illegal for you to air your grievances to elec…

Aside from the fact that many countries have ways of limiting lobbyist influence through law, a simple but dramatic way would be to say: 0. Lobbying is a right, but one that can only be exercised by individual citizens, not corporations. 1. Anyone who wishes to "lobby" congressional candidates or congresspersons must register their financial interests 2. Make it illegal to directly accept money for lobbying services…

[deleted]

Re: Netflix Posted Biggest-Ever Profit in 2018 and Paid $0 in Income Taxes

#283

Post by chongli »

PurpleBoxDragon wrote: post #261
SilasX wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is that simple (in the sense of the parent's post): you need to know the specifics of why they were paying no taxes. If, as in the comment, they were carrying over losses, then there's nothing really objectionable. You lost $10 million last year. You profited $10 million this year. Over a reasonable horizon, you weren't profitable. Did they get a specific exemption against the public interest that no one else got?…

>Over a reasonable horizon, you weren't profitable. The average worker isn't allowed to do that even when they lose money in a given year. Why is it so naturally assumed to be acceptable for a business to do it? Maybe the time is to just remove the loopholes in general from both business and personal income taxes.

Why is it so naturally assumed to be acceptable for a business to do it?

Because a business isn't a person. Taxing a business is taking real money away from payrolls, money that would get taxed again anyway once it was paid out.

Corporate income tax only makes sense when you look at it as a barrier to entry for competition in the marketplace. Big companies like Netflix know how to avoid taxes. Small companies don't. Thus corporate income taxes help to protect big companies from disruption by small ones.

Re: Netflix Posted Biggest-Ever Profit in 2018 and Paid $0 in Income Taxes

#284

Post by nsxwolf »

PurpleBoxDragon wrote: post #261
SilasX wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is that simple (in the sense of the parent's post): you need to know the specifics of why they were paying no taxes. If, as in the comment, they were carrying over losses, then there's nothing really objectionable. You lost $10 million last year. You profited $10 million this year. Over a reasonable horizon, you weren't profitable. Did they get a specific exemption against the public interest that no one else got?…

>Over a reasonable horizon, you weren't profitable. The average worker isn't allowed to do that even when they lose money in a given year. Why is it so naturally assumed to be acceptable for a business to do it? Maybe the time is to just remove the loopholes in general from both business and personal income taxes.

What do you mean by "lose money"? There are plenty of kinds of losses that the average worker might incur that would offset their income tax. It could be a capital loss on an investment. It could be casualty losses from theft or a fire.

Re: Netflix Posted Biggest-Ever Profit in 2018 and Paid $0 in Income Taxes

#285

Post by mikeash »

SilasX wrote: post #242
rayiner wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it's due to carryover losses, which is usually what this sort of rage bait boils down to, it's not only "legal" but "not wrong." Carryover losses are the mathematical byproduct of a tax system that taxes gains in wealth ( i.e. income) but must be sampled annually. It would be completely brain damaged to treat two companies differently that make the same total profit over a fixed period depending merely on the patt…

Agreed, but, in fairness, the personal income tax contains exactly this brain damage. If I make $100k in one year and then $10k the next, I pay 19% of it in income taxes, even though I averaged $55k/year which should mean paying 14.6% of it in taxes. (Using figures for a single filer from the 2019 brackets; assuming away the person deduction for simplicity.) https://www.nerdwallet.com/blog/taxes/federal-income-tax-br…

Even worse, individuals pay taxes on revenue, not profit, aside from a very narrow set of deductible expenses.

Re: Netflix Posted Biggest-Ever Profit in 2018 and Paid $0 in Income Taxes

#286

Post by AlexTWithBeard »

PurpleBoxDragon wrote: post #261
SilasX wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is that simple (in the sense of the parent's post): you need to know the specifics of why they were paying no taxes. If, as in the comment, they were carrying over losses, then there's nothing really objectionable. You lost $10 million last year. You profited $10 million this year. Over a reasonable horizon, you weren't profitable. Did they get a specific exemption against the public interest that no one else got?…

>Over a reasonable horizon, you weren't profitable. The average worker isn't allowed to do that even when they lose money in a given year. Why is it so naturally assumed to be acceptable for a business to do it? Maybe the time is to just remove the loopholes in general from both business and personal income taxes.

An average worker has few job-related expenses.

Re: Netflix Posted Biggest-Ever Profit in 2018 and Paid $0 in Income Taxes

#287

Post by saberience »

refurb wrote: post #88
40acres wrote: post #32

I assume this has something to do with the massive amount of debt that fuels Netflix original programming. That being said, our entire tax system is regressive, for both businesses and individuals, when it comes to dealing with it's complexity. A small or medium size business does not have the legal or accounting capability to navigate the tax code as successfully as a company like Netflix can. Similarly, even a high…

Regressive? The top 1% of earners paid the highest tax rate of 27.1%. The bottom 50% had an average tax rate of 3.5%.[1] [1] https://taxfoundation.org/summary-federal-income-tax-data-20...

It is absolutely regressive when the top earners, presumably earning millions more than I do, end up paying less tax than I do.

Re: Netflix Posted Biggest-Ever Profit in 2018 and Paid $0 in Income Taxes

#288

Post by checkyoursudo »

scarface74 wrote: post #278
otachack wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not that simple. Companies lobby to keep, even coerce, laws that benefit them and allow these sorts of things to happen. What is the common person, or collection of persons, supposed to do when they are against that kind of force? I believe one way is to actually be involved in politics and get into the seats that govern and make the laws. But it's easier said than done.

Corporate taxes are value destructive. A company is either going to use that money to expand, creating a more jobs, paying employees more - who will pay taxes, or buy back stock or pay dividends. The only real issue I have is the difference between capital gains taxes and income taxes.

"Value destructive" to whom? I don't want all the companies in my area to pay excessive taxes, but they also don't otherwise pay for any negative externalities that they cause or contribute to, except through taxes.

I don't want to shoulder the burden alone for their roads and traffic and pollution and power-grid-improvement requirements et cetera.

Maybe the system could be different where companies directly pay for the road upgrades they need and the power infrastructure upgrades they need, etc, but that's not the system we have where I live.

Re: Netflix Posted Biggest-Ever Profit in 2018 and Paid $0 in Income Taxes

#289

Post by qaq »

otachack wrote: post #46
driverdan wrote: post #34

Rather than being outraged at the headline, what are the actual details? Why were they able to pay no taxes? Was it due to carried losses or something like that? Anyone mad at a company for not pay taxes is misdirecting their anger. Companies follow the law. If you don't like the law elect different politicians. Don't get mad at companies that follow the law.

It's not that simple. Companies lobby to keep, even coerce, laws that benefit them and allow these sorts of things to happen. What is the common person, or collection of persons, supposed to do when they are against that kind of force? I believe one way is to actually be involved in politics and get into the seats that govern and make the laws. But it's easier said than done.

The thing that common person is unlikely to do care enough to allocate time and money to this.

Re: Netflix Posted Biggest-Ever Profit in 2018 and Paid $0 in Income Taxes

#290

Post by nikanj »

chongli wrote: post #283
PurpleBoxDragon wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Over a reasonable horizon, you weren't profitable. The average worker isn't allowed to do that even when they lose money in a given year. Why is it so naturally assumed to be acceptable for a business to do it? Maybe the time is to just remove the loopholes in general from both business and personal income taxes.

Why is it so naturally assumed to be acceptable for a business to do it? Because a business isn't a person. Taxing a business is taking real money away from payrolls, money that would get taxed again anyway once it was paid out. Corporate income tax only makes sense when you look at it as a barrier to entry for competition in the marketplace. Big companies like Netflix know how to avoid taxes. Small companies don't.…

Citizens United v FEC disagrees with you.
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