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Interview with Mr. Money Mustache

blog.ycombinator.com

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Re: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache

#281

Post by CodeCube »

wang_li wrote: post #132
reverend_gonzo wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reason to rent is for the ability to move on demand. If a family is renting in the same place for decades, that is their problem. The moment you realize you are going to stay in one place for an extended period of time, there is no reason to continue renting. Sure, not everybody can purchase their dream home. But they can purchase something small, build equity, and upgrade in the future. The government also has p…

Renters are also borrowing the credit score and down payment of the landlord.

Yes, but it should be temporary (to be ethical) ... if a single entity is a long-term tenant, that should be proof that they are a responsible, and should begin to accrue equity in the asset they are paying tons of money into.

Re: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache

#282

Post by CodeCube »

jmilloy wrote: post #172
djrogers wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What exactly should be the relationship between the person who owns a home and the person that lives in it then? One of charity? Or do you think private home ownership is in and of itself wrong?

There is a position in between "all rental arrangements are okay" and "no rental arrangements are okay". I think the parent and others that dislike rent-seeking would have no ethical objection if the landlord charged an amount corresponding to costs of maintaining and renting the house (taxes, upkeep, risk, management, etc). The objection is when a landlord is able to work a few hours a month managing their propertie…

exactly this ... there needs to be a discussion about what the right balance to strike is. Rent-to-own would be a fantastic thing to be more popular (especially if you can take your equity with you when you leave ... even if only a portion of it, so that renting/risk still has rewards (yes I realize this arrangement probably isn't common (if at all), but it should be)).

Re: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache

#283

Post by CodeCube »

koonsolo wrote: post #231
CodeCube wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personally, I find rent-seeking landlords to be an unethical pursuit. I know that's not a mainstream thought, and is the underpinning of many people's income strategy ... but I can't support the idea of letting a family live in a property for decades, and then something happening, and they're on the street with nothing to show for the tens of thousands of dollars they have given in rent.

I'm sure you have some properties where families can live for free, or at least only have to pay half of the rent? Or you give away interest free montages so they can buy their own place? If not, what the fuck are you talking about then? Landlords offer a service for money. Since when is that unethical?

People price gouging during disasters is "offering a good or service for money", and it is unethical (and illegal). I propose that long-term gains from a single tenant, without an exchange of value (equity) is unethical. If you own a house, and one person/family has been living there for decades and then have to leave for some reason, they should not be leaving with a zero balance ... they've paid tens of thousands of dollars, and for a landlord to simply take it, and just rent it out to the next schmuck in a few weeks is unethical.

Re: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache

#284

Post by kbutler »

CodeCube wrote: post #279
kbutler wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I can't support the idea of letting a family buy food for decades, then something happening, and they're starving with nothing to show for the tens of thousands of dollars they have spent on food."

Housing is not a perishable resource (to an extent, yes I realize maintenance is a thing). It's not comparable

> maintenance is a thing Yeah, I used to think "home ownership" meant I owned the home, not the other way around.

Speaking as a homeowner, with a garden, fruit trees, and formerly chickens and goats, they're very comparable.

Renting meets the daily housing need, without ownership in the assets that provide for that need in the future.

Buying food meets the daily food need, without ownership in the assets that provide for that need in the future.

Alternatively, people could buy land and equipment/building and develop skills to use/maintain them, allowing them to meet their future food/housing needs.

The key element is that people can choose how they want to spend their resources (money, time, and attention). Sometimes buying is better, sometimes renting is. And yes, people do often make decisions that turn out not to have been in their best long-term interest.

Re: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache

#285

Post by ryanmercer317 »

I know the vast majority of you are 6-figure types and MMM is still making 6 figures annually from his blog and his wife's 'hobby' business and that he never actually has to touch his retirement investments and can in fact add more money to them annually than most people in the U.S. actually gross.

According to the U.S Census Bureau "The per capita income for the overall population in 2008 was $26,964; for non-Hispanic Whites, it was $31,313; for Blacks, it was $18,406; for Asians, it was $30,292; and for Hispanics, it was $15,674."

It's taken me 11 years to get to 32k, I got super lucky early this summer and got hired for some remote work, full time on top of my current job, for a tech company thanks to someone at YC helping me out. A day after I started I was told I was inelligible for employment because several years ago I had to file bankruptcy.

So while you all sit nice and well with your 6-figure incomes, talking about how horrible your lives are when you earn more in a year than I do in 3-5 years BEFORE your bonuses and 401k match and all the benefits you get that real businesses don't offer their employees... just know a lot of us are busting our asses just to feed ourselves.

Re: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache

#286

Post by ryanmercer317 »

sjg007 wrote: post #111

I find it interesting that both he and his wife were high income earner earners. That makes it easier to save appropriately and get to financial freedom sooner. I think he even notes this in some of his blog posts that the opportunity to become financially free is limited. A lot of people don't have a 3 month or 6 month reserve which I think is the first goal. Get there first.

He and his wife are STILL high income earners. From his affiliate links, sponsored posts and going on and on about his wife's etsy business I guarantee you they are still making six figures without ever having to touch their retirement investments. Call him out on that and guess what, he will NOT approve the comment on his posts.

Re: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache

#287

Post by ryanmercer317 »

otterpro wrote: post #184

The easiest way to retire early is to enlist in the military, at least in the US, anyway. After 20 years of service, you are set for life with life-long retirement pension and healthcare. Of course, there's a high risk, since there's always wars and deployments, etc and many don't make it past 10 years, after they get fed up with being in the military. When I was in the army, I saw a lot of people in their early 40's…

It's also a great way to end up with nagging injuries for the rest of your life, PTSD and or certain death.

Re: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache

#288

Post by ryanmercer317 »

crabasa wrote: post #11
dsacco wrote: post #4

Something I’m curious about regarding Mr. Money Mustache - is he actually retired, in the sense that he doesn’t do anything to bring in income (except through passive index investing)? It seems like he has a brand that is pretty lucrative, so it’s unclear to me if he: 1. has enough money to be functionally retired at his current lifestyle, but chooses to continue his brand anyway, 2. has enough money to be functional…

The answers to your question is here: http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2017/05/19/2016-spending/ tl;dr - He is still very frugal, unless you count his business expenses. He definitely works on his business and brings in income, but he gives much of it away.

He's not frugal, he is very creative with his accounting. In the post you linked he deducts his medical expenses and food expenses.

Also if you look at the post you linked "Does not include the $30k detached Studio I built." 30k$ is more than a LOT of people gross annually in the U.S. and he claims it doesn't count as an expense which conveniently keeps his budget 30k$ smaller than it in fact was.

According to the U.S Census Bureau "The per capita income for the overall population in 2008 was $26,964; for non-Hispanic Whites, it was $31,313; for Blacks, it was $18,406; for Asians, it was $30,292; and for Hispanics, it was $15,674." which are all less than his 30k$ "hey guys it doesn't count I added a whole new room to my house" creative budget.

Re: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache

#289

Post by ryanmercer317 »

vasilipupkin wrote: post #220
mod wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you play poker for fun and win some money while you're at it, are you working? What about slots? What about buying antiques, and you wind up with something worth a bunch of money? I think calling it work requires the intent of earning money. And I agree that MMM is no longer retired.

Look, claiming you are retired while regularly doing 3 jobs for money is disingenuous in my opinion.

BINGO! And he bends the truth with his budget, go look at http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2017/05/19/2016-spending/

Claims they live off of 'About $22,000' after saying that his 30k$ home addition does not count in his budget because it's not a necessary expense... "Finish materials for my house and the homes of some friends/family. Does not include the $30k detached Studio I built."

That's extremely deceptive.

Re: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache

#290

Post by kdamken »

astura wrote: post #239
markdog12 wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe other bloggers were "privileged", but MMM grew up in a family that didn't have a ton of money, and he payed for his own college via jobs he worked as a teenager. In short, he worked his ass off.

I worked my ass off to get where I am financially. I grew up with low income, abusive, mentally ill, and alcoholic parents. I wasn't taught hardly any life skills and I had no "connections" of which to speak. I worked hard to get where I am now (I save/invest 70% of my income a year) but I don't for a second discount luck as a big part of it. Someone making similar choices as I did can surely have a different outcome…

Who you marry is hands down one of the largest factors in your overall financial success. Especially when it comes to the risk of divorce.
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