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Windows 10 for Raspberry Pi 2

dev.windows.com

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Re: Windows 10 for Raspberry Pi 2

#271

Post by jauer »

wfunction wrote: post #260
okasaki wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just off the top of my head: package management, live-cd functionality, architecture support, command-line interfaces, GUI variety, kernel customization, scaling to low-powered harware, licencing.

GUI "variety" ? Are you joking? The very reason there exists so much "variety" is that they all suck. Windows has one GUI system and it's worked darn well for quite a long time, and will continue to do so. Linux might be able to let you make your windows do somersaults so you can show off to your friends, but it still hasn't been able to get the basics right, like focus-stealing prevention. Windows is miles ahead of…

Also, Windows has package management in the form of Chocolatey/OneGet: http://blogs.technet.com/b/windowsserver/archive/2014/04/03/.... It just isn't used by most end-users so awareness is limited.

Re: Windows 10 for Raspberry Pi 2

#272

Post by cheald »

zxcvcxz wrote: post #211
superobserver wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's in Microsoft interest to keep kids in their ecosystem Yep, which is also why they purchased Minecraft. It was more like purchasing the community of Minecraft users, which has a lot of children as well. I really wished there were a Micronix or something - combining the best of both worlds (Microsoft's extensive resources and reach coupled with GNU/Linux freedom and open-source development) - and that probably i…

Bill Gates can't continue espousing the ideas that everyone should have access to healthcare/technology/internet and be on the board of a company that charges way too much for an OS that --let's be honest-- isn't really miles ahead of any other OS... I did like the fact that he posted a picture of kids using Ubuntu on his FB page though.

I know the whole Micro$oft thing is fun and all, but Microsoft does put an awful lot of money towards providing technology in developing countries (OLPC, for example), as well as general philanthropy for non-profits. "Making a profit" and "spreading information access to those who don't have it" are not mutually exclusive.

Re: Windows 10 for Raspberry Pi 2

#273

Post by acadien »

wfunction wrote: post #260
okasaki wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just off the top of my head: package management, live-cd functionality, architecture support, command-line interfaces, GUI variety, kernel customization, scaling to low-powered harware, licencing.

GUI "variety" ? Are you joking? The very reason there exists so much "variety" is that they all suck. Windows has one GUI system and it's worked darn well for quite a long time, and will continue to do so. Linux might be able to let you make your windows do somersaults so you can show off to your friends, but it still hasn't been able to get the basics right, like focus-stealing prevention. Windows is miles ahead of…

"miles ahead of Windows for research" For example, only 2 of the currently fastest 500 super computers run Windows and 1 of them is owned by Microsoft. All of the others run Linux or Unix.

"Since when are 25-year-old command-line shells research products?" The shell is a researcher's best friend as they have always been (and will be for the foreseeable future) the direct interface between data and the user. I honestly can't think of a faster and easier way to parse a nasty 10GB log file from a simulation than bash. The fact that its old and still in use is a testament to its usefulness.

Re: Windows 10 for Raspberry Pi 2

#274

Post by cheald »

jauer wrote: post #271
wfunction wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GUI "variety" ? Are you joking? The very reason there exists so much "variety" is that they all suck. Windows has one GUI system and it's worked darn well for quite a long time, and will continue to do so. Linux might be able to let you make your windows do somersaults so you can show off to your friends, but it still hasn't been able to get the basics right, like focus-stealing prevention. Windows is miles ahead of…

Also, Windows has package management in the form of Chocolatey/OneGet: http://blogs.technet.com/b/windowsserver/archive/2014/04/03/... . It just isn't used by most end-users so awareness is limited.

Ehhh....that's "installer downloading and executing", which is a far cry from "package management". Notably, it doesn't provide dependency resolution (which is 90% of a package manager's job, IMO), and Windows' software packaging conventions don't really work well for an apt-like system, since they are intended to be mostly self-contained outside of shared frameworks.

I use chocolatey, but it's not anywhere near the level of apt-get. That's more Windows and Windows developers' fault than chocolatey's though. They've done a great job given what they have to work with.

Re: Windows 10 for Raspberry Pi 2

#275

Post by tkubacki »

andyjohnson0 wrote: post #48
paulojreis wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Meta: Why all the anti-MS cynicism on the threads for this topic? Isn't it kind of old now? I feel bad when I have the "anti-MS" feeling. I truly do; I feel like I'm being over-simplistic, I feel that I'm being prejudiced... Well, you get the point. However, you can't really say this is "kind of old". "Embrace, extend and extinguish" practices are recent, even considering the short "horizons" in IT. And, after the…

"finding these MS initiatives a lot like "hangin' with the cool kids" or "sounding hip"." This announcement is undoubtedly partly publicity-driven. But its also about keeping Windows visible and relevant to groups who may not use PCs much. And if the RPi does become the standard IoT hardware platform, then Microsoft will want a bit of that too. And embrace, extend, extinguish makes no sense in a community-driven ecos…

>And embrace, extend, extinguish makes no sense in a community-driven ecosystem. MS knows that

So assuming EEE would "make sense in community-driven ecosystem" they still would do that. Wouldn't they ?

I'm ok with Windows on Rasp2 - Linux needs competition.

Re: Windows 10 for Raspberry Pi 2

#276

Post by doczoidberg »

mark_l_watson wrote: post #174
belgianguy wrote: post #73

I don't think Microsoft is doing it for the Open-Source spirit, as many seem to believe. They have a long history of attacking/smearing open source and displaying a "I heart Linux" slide is not sufficient to erase all the FUD and their questionable software patent licensing schemes (which are completely anti-open). They called Linux a cancer, even. I think they're approaching this from a redundancy point of view, if…

Microsoft Azure has very good support for Linux. One thing I like in particular is how quick it is to reboot a running Linux VPS with more or less memory and CPU. It has made me reconsider using vertical scaling in addition to horizontal scaling for some applications. Faster and easier than with AWS. Except for writing a commercial app for Windows 1.0, I have not been much of a Microsoft fan over the years but that h…

rebooting/starting Linux on a VPS takes much more time on Azure for me? This is the case I use AWS instead of Azure for my VMs.

Re: Windows 10 for Raspberry Pi 2

#277

Post by morganvachon »

cliffbean wrote: post #263
morganvachon wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given that Microsoft is steadily becoming more open-source friendly and I'm seeing them being ridiculed for it across the web, I'd say a lot of old prejudice is at play. Besides, Google's version of Android is also proprietary software that is not only harmful to user freedom, it's also more and more privacy hostile every day. Yet Google is still held as the pinnacle of open source friendly companies in some circles.…

I distinguish between proprietary apps and proprietary kernel. The open source world can build its own apps. Mostly. However, it can't build its own kernel if the hardware is undocumented and/or only supported by OS-specific binary blobs. Drivers are key to a lot of things. MS is a lot more open-source friendly, and smarter, but it's pretty clear that this is a strategy to get more people tied into ecosystems which f…

I don't disagree, and I'll add that the Raspberry Pi is still encumbered by a binary blob that is required to boot, no matter the actual OS that is loaded after. I for one would absolutely love to see a 100% fully documented, Free and Open Source development board, from the board layout, to the CPU/GPU design, the boot code, and all kernel and userland software.

Unfortunately there is no real market interest for such a device, so I'll take what I can get.

Re: Windows 10 for Raspberry Pi 2

#278

Post by trentnelson »

slipstream- wrote: post #105
trentnelson wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> http://gate.upm.ro/os/LABs/Windows_OS_Internals_Curriculum_R... Oh my. Aaaaand, mirrored. There's also this, which seems about the same level of should-this-actually-be-publicly-available: https://github.com/njdragonfly/WinNT4

Wait, someone put the (partially-)leaked NT4 src on github of all places? DMCA takedown from MS in 3...2..1...

I know right, at least make your repo private ;-)

(I was more surprised that this source dump doesn't seem to line up with the "Windows 2000" source leak that can be found if you look hard enough. Very peculiar.)

Re: Windows 10 for Raspberry Pi 2

#279

Post by evilduck »

rplnt wrote: post #233
zxcvcxz wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bill Gates can't continue espousing the ideas that everyone should have access to healthcare/technology/internet and be on the board of a company that charges way too much for an OS that --let's be honest-- isn't really miles ahead of any other OS... I did like the fact that he posted a picture of kids using Ubuntu on his FB page though.

Is it more expensive than OS X though? Windows licenses are like $50 for OEM. With OS X you have to constantly buy upgrades since their support period is short. I might be wrong though, never bought an OS X license.

OSX has moved to a free OS upgrade model as of two releases ago and very cheap upgrades for the two releases before that (the last 5 years of OSX upgrades cost less than any single Windows OEM upgrade of the same time period). The most recent release supports most of their computers from 2009 and much of the more-capable hardware from 2007 (basically all the way back to the first Intel-based Pro Mac lines).

Yeah, it's shorter than MS and Linux support windows but I wouldn't describe it as "constantly buying upgrades" either.

Re: Windows 10 for Raspberry Pi 2

#280

Post by doczoidberg »

benn_88 wrote: post #79

Note: Windows 10 on Pi 2 will be an IoT platform, not a desktop OS. You'll develop your app in Visual Studio on a Windows PC and deploy it to the Pi. Raspbian will continue to be the main supported OS. - Ben from Raspberry Pi

But it will run Windows 10 and Windows Universal Apps:

http://www.hanselman.com/blog/TheNewRaspberryPi2WillRunWindo...

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