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"Open Source is awful in many ways, and people should be aware of this"

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Re: "Open Source is awful in many ways, and people should be aware of this"

#271

Post by sergiosgc »

freehunter wrote: post #164
vidarh wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How you managed to read that into the message above is totally beyond me.

>This is a Linus' flaw, of course, but one we can live with in the context of his hugely positive net contribution. Said in response to a comment by Linus directly stating that someone should be retroactively aborted (murdered).

Be reasonable. Do you seriously read that meaning into Linus' message? Couldn't it have an interpretation other than a literal one? I know a lot gets lost in written format, but ... come on!

Re: "Open Source is awful in many ways, and people should be aware of this"

#272

Post by yummyfajitas »

minikites wrote: post #169
yummyfajitas wrote: post #138

So I'm a blogger with posts that occasionally go semi-viral [1], and I've been subject to unpleasant comments on a few occasions. Here are a couple of posts which have gotten me quite a bit of hate: http://www.chrisstucchio.com/blog/2013/basic_income_vs_basic... http://www.chrisstucchio.com/blog/2014/equal_weights.html In both cases they are posts about mathematics which use other topics (economics, dating) as concre…

This is different for men and women. http://www.psmag.com/navigation/health-and-behavior/women-ar... "Accounts with feminine usernames incurred an average of 100 sexually explicit or threatening messages a day. Masculine names received 3.7." http://time.com/3305466/male-female-harassment-online/ The study pointed out that the harassment targeted at men is not because they are men, as is clearly more frequently the ca…

This is a bit of a change of subject. Lennert Pottering is male.

Would the aforementioned unpleasant behavior be more acceptable to you if it were directed via a random number generator (i.e. a random set of people are singled out to receive 100 messages/day) rather than a predictable decision process?

Re: "Open Source is awful in many ways, and people should be aware of this"

#273

Post by snowwrestler »

digital-rubber wrote: post #117

Systemd and PulseAudio are getting pushed down everybody's throat, unasked for. They are both horrible to work with and suck quite a bit, both introduced way prematurely and buggy. Why did he not roll his own distro fully based on systemd to convince people it is so cool? instead of rolling out his own distro, people responsible for distro package/rolling were convinced it should be added to the default; as it was so…

> Why did he not roll his own distro fully based on systemd to convince people it is so cool?

Why don't you roll your own distro and keep init in that?

I'm honestly not trying to troll. Isn't the point of open source that each individual can do what they want with the code? Why is it someone else's responsibility to maintain code options that you want, but they don't?

Re: "Open Source is awful in many ways, and people should be aware of this"

#274

Post by crististm »

aidenn0 wrote: post #259

Lennart specifically called out Gentoo; as a Gentoo user, I do want to speak up in defense of the Gentoo community. I will concede the point that Lennart has, by far, probably received more vitriol per-capita from the Gentoo community than any others. I'm not going to defend any of the personal attacks launched on him. However, Lennart writes very opinionated software, and the opinions it takes are more at clash with…

Indeed. About ten years ago, there was a saying on Gentoo site saying that it is a bug if you can't customize your gentoo system the way you want it.

Personal attacks are not OK, but he should keep his opinion on what _my_ machine should do for himself. For what it is worth, his systemd is a bug.

Re: "Open Source is awful in many ways, and people should be aware of this"

#275

Post by tessierashpool »

Re this part, about Linus Torvalds being aggressive and insulting to his contributors:

  But no, it's not an efficient way to run a community. If
  Linux had success, then that certainly happened despite,
  not because of this behaviour.
You have to have been utterly brilliant to invent git. I don't know enough about operating system internals to say if the same is true for Linux, but I know enough about git to say it's true for git.

So Linus was brilliant enough to invent git, and is widely known to be a complete asshole to his contributors.

He rarely brags about being a genius - in fact I believe I've seen him on video making modest statements about being overrated and not really that smart - but he often argues that being an asshole to his contributors is a wise and effective form of management.

To me, he seems like an epoch-definingly great hacker who nonetheless has absolutely no clue what his own strengths and weaknesses are.

Re: "Open Source is awful in many ways, and people should be aware of this"

#276

Post by tomjen3 »

bhouston wrote: post #107

I'll probably get burned for saying this but I think this is related to GamerGate/SocialJusticeWarriors. I think that other controversy is being portrayed as anti-feminist (and there is a lot of undertones of that) but I think that it is more indicative of a general problem -- it is basically unrestrained incivility against those whom one has disagreements, or who has done perceived wrongs. For some reason it has bec…

You are overlooking who the author is. There are plenty of people (me among them) who would be exceedingly happy if systemd died a horrible death - thus there are people who wouldn't want to have him develop any more software, some go to the extreme of sending death threats.

Re: "Open Source is awful in many ways, and people should be aware of this"

#277

Post by vidarh »

freehunter wrote: post #164
vidarh wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How you managed to read that into the message above is totally beyond me.

>This is a Linus' flaw, of course, but one we can live with in the context of his hugely positive net contribution. Said in response to a comment by Linus directly stating that someone should be retroactively aborted (murdered).

It takes an extreme lack of understanding of how people actually use English to believe that Linus was actually advocating murder with the message he made, no matter the literal content.

If you seriously believe he was advocating murder, I presume you have reported the matter to the police, as in that case it is a criminal offence.

Re: "Open Source is awful in many ways, and people should be aware of this"

#278

Post by nanoscopic »

qwerta wrote: post #216
nanoscopic wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Go ahead and Google my name. You'll find that it is mostly just attacks on my character related to an incident with UMD and the FBI. Unfortunately people don't reference facts; news ( and people in general ) just believe what they want. Once again, my point in referencing these people is to say that negative attitudes and attacks are widespread, and happens by many professional ( the people I mentioned ). I don't bla…

But I do not care that some guy refused to approve your name or whatever. I do care, that you are shaming people you do not like on public forum. It is pretty much same behavior as Linus and other a*holes in OS community. Congrats on top comment BTW.

I'd like to point out that I have a lot of respect for the developers I named; my point is that we should all play nicely, not that I wish for these people to be shamed. People get hurt. I was hurt. I'm not attacking; I am saying it still hurts to be treated that way by members of the community, and that I agree with the notion that you need to have a thick skin. It shouldn't be this way; the entire open source community should strive to improve the world together, not fight about which project is better.

Notice above comment from mst ( Matt S Trout ). I appreciate him saying sorry and it actually means a lot to me. I have even more respect for those who recognize when their actions have been misunderstood and hurt people. He didn't need to apologize, but it helps the community and I wish more developers were willing to see that there are many different opinions and we need to respect them all.

Re: "Open Source is awful in many ways, and people should be aware of this"

#279

Post by Alupis »

nanoscopic wrote: post #253
Alupis wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You make a lot of good points, but I take issue with: > me for pointing out bugs in his software that he refuses to acknowledge Sometimes this is a perspective thing. It's not always a bug just because some user reports it as a bug in their opinion. Don't know the story behind that anecdote, but perhaps you didn't understand the codebase like you thought you did, or what the expected behavior should of been? In any r…

The specific bug was in the Varnish reverse proxy. It had to do with the non-functionality of the ESI ( Edge Side Includes ) "support". I really like Varnish and was making great use of it, and was happy to learn it supported ESI. I thought that if you change the contents of an ESI file, and then invalidate that file in Varnish, that Varnish would know the files that include it and invalidate them as well. Nope. Varn…

Just to parlay -

This page has not been edited in over 3 years and says Varnish does not have full ESI support:

https://www.varnish-cache.org/trac/wiki/ESIfeatures

Perhaps you missed it, or perhaps this anecdote took place prior to this page's posting.

In either case, seems it was a misunderstanding - which goes back to my first comment about a reported bug is not always a real bug just because one (or a few) users believe it to be.

Re: "Open Source is awful in many ways, and people should be aware of this"

#280

Post by pyre »

tomp wrote: post #220
pyre wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To summarize: The tech community has become weak because we have taken a look at ourselves and realized that many among us are brutish, brash, and generally all-around assholes. But since these people are highly skilled, we should feel that the fact that they are assholes should be swept under the rug and we should "just deal with it." I get that these things exist and that we have to deal with them (change doesn't h…

> Is it wrong to want to change things? No. It's not wrong to not want to change them either. I like Linus. He delivers. Many people talk nice, but it's all bullshit.

> Many people talk nice, but it's all bullshit.

Are you stating that you believe that there is a direct 1:1 correlation between people talking in a civil manner and people being "all bullshit"?

Are you also stating that calling someone names when telling them they are wrong somehow adds credibility to opinion of the name-caller? What about political attack ads that spend all of their time smearing the person rather than their policies?

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