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No skin thick enough: The daily harassment of women in the game industry

polygon.com

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Re: No skin thick enough: The daily harassment of women in the game industry

#271

Post by Fomite »

oldmanjay wrote: post #258
Fomite wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or, more likely, believe that any circumstance where being called fat or dorky is a serious threat to your well being will also be a circumstance where people musing about your rape and death will be a serious threat to your well being. Especially as, for women, body shaming and rape threats often come hand in hand.

I'm sorry, what do threats have to do with insults? Conflating the two is a classic technique in this strange attempt to create some sort of right to never be offended, but they have no relationship to each other at all.

"I'm sorry, what do threats have to do with insults? Conflating the two is a classic technique in this strange attempt to create some sort of right to never be offended, but they have no relationship to each other at all."

They do have a relationship - indeed, there's two of them embedded in this conversation, one of which you introduced:

1. Insults as a form of threat to one's health, in the form of pushing someone toward suicide. As noted, this relationship between an insult and a threat was of your own creation.

2. Rape threats are insults. They are suggestions that a woman (or man) is a lesser being. A thing. Something to be commented on, their violation a subject of idle speculation. Their autonomy denied because of who they are. All those are insults, as well as threats.

Re: No skin thick enough: The daily harassment of women in the game industry

#272

Post by oldmanjay »

Fomite wrote: post #220
oldmanjay wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Clearly my downvoters have never been insulted while suicidal

Or, more likely, believe that any circumstance where being called fat or dorky is a serious threat to your well being will also be a circumstance where people musing about your rape and death will be a serious threat to your well being. Especially as, for women, body shaming and rape threats often come hand in hand.

No, I didn't introduce an insult/threat having a relationship. Insulting someone who is in the wrong frame of mind is still not a threat.

I understand that we are simply going to disagree on this, so I won't bother rebutting anything else, but I'd appreciate you not adding context to my own thoughts.

Re: No skin thick enough: The daily harassment of women in the game industry

#273

Post by [deleted] »

glibgil wrote: post #202
hnnewguy wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Am I doing it right? Maybe. But I couldn't care less what some anonymous dude on the internet thinks about my penis. Won't even skip a beat. Am I doing it wrong?

You're not OP. I was talking to OP. Do you agree when he wrote, "Get over it. If you can't get over it, don't play with people you don't know."?

[deleted]

Re: No skin thick enough: The daily harassment of women in the game industry

#274

Post by georgiapeach »

glibgil wrote: post #202
hnnewguy wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Am I doing it right? Maybe. But I couldn't care less what some anonymous dude on the internet thinks about my penis. Won't even skip a beat. Am I doing it wrong?

You're not OP. I was talking to OP. Do you agree when he wrote, "Get over it. If you can't get over it, don't play with people you don't know."?

I agree wholeheartedly with hnnewguy.

He doesn't care. I don't care. Nobody cares.

Our complete and utter lack of an emotional reaction to your attempt to provoke is conclusive evidence that this sort of thing is simply not a big deal.

You are just wrong.

Grow up already.

Re: No skin thick enough: The daily harassment of women in the game industry

#275

Post by georgiapeach »

arrrg wrote: post #63
Zikes wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's good to see that sloganeering and thought-terminating cliches will drive what could have been a proper debate on the issue. I guess there's no room at all for dissenting opinions, especially when they point out hypocrisies or bring counter evidence to the discussion.

What hypocrisies? There are none. You are imagining those. When there is something you cannot understand it’s proper to address that with “Men just don’t …” That’s ok. It’s no claim that all men act disgustingly, it’s only a claim that men don’t understand. That’s also completely unrelated to the “What can you – as a man – do to help?” part. I mean, where is the connection there. You are saying very confusing things.

> You are saying very confusing things.

So you admit that you just cannot understand.

Ha!

Re: No skin thick enough: The daily harassment of women in the game industry

#276

Post by georgiapeach »

Geekette wrote: post #41

These are the sorts of issues that make one wish anonymity online was impossible or always traceable. The cowardice that lives in people is astounding. For those muttering the free speech line: freedom of speech ≠ freedom of consequences.

Actually, the Founding Fathers did consider anonymity to be an essential component of free speech, which is why they published the Federalist Papers anonymously.

TL;DR You're wrong.

Re: No skin thick enough: The daily harassment of women in the game industry

#277

Post by georgiapeach »

Jemaclus wrote: post #68
EarthLaunch wrote: post #6

What should a game studio to do counter this and make its employees safe from it?

I think the best thing to do as far as internal harassment goes is to basically have a no tolerance policy from the higher-ups. Not so much a "you'll get fired" thing but having everyone step up and say "Hey, that's not cool" when someone makes a sexist joke. At my job, we had a guy for awhile who would post funny pictures in chat. Every once in awhile, he'd post something NSFW (not necessarily nudity) and all the gu…

Good job equating death threats with what some easily offended pearl-clutcher thinks is a sexist joke.

Re: No skin thick enough: The daily harassment of women in the game industry

#278

Post by georgiapeach »

JonnieCache wrote: post #32

Ironically, "woman is the nigger of the world" is a quote from Yoko Ono and the title of a song she did with John Lennon; it was meant to be a piece of feminist sloganeering. Somebody got a bit confused.

Nope, they just reappropriated the quote.

Re: No skin thick enough: The daily harassment of women in the game industry

#279

Post by cushychicken »

dfxm12 wrote: post #183
cushychicken wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I hate to "Not all men" this, but I wish we would stop treating behavior like this as a normal part of the male psyche. It's not. It's seriously disturbed. I think that realization is the very opposite of the "Not all men" mindset. Saying "Not all men are like that" is a red herring - it's a way of distracting yourself from the fact that there are people out there who treat women like dirt by saying you don't do tha…

I would love some kind of resource for how to do that effectively. You don't need a resource. Do it yourself. Do it in situations where no one else will. This will encourage other to. This isn't an issue that's going to go away without grassroots support. There's no silver bullet, it's going to take work and unfortunately, time.

Maybe what I meant was some kind of a way to do this without provoking a confrontation.

Perhaps that's just the nature of the beast, though.

Re: No skin thick enough: The daily harassment of women in the game industry

#280

Post by hackuser »

ThomPete wrote: post #269
hackuser wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Men are presented as objects just as women are, that is how you sell in 20 seconds. It's not the same, because women are politically/socially much more vulnerable. If you are one woman in an office of 10 men, one of the men objectifying you is a threat, but not vice-versa. If you are blue in a world run by green people, constant advertisements objectifying blue people is threatening, but not those objectifying gree…

Men are found in the top and the bottom of society. Men are much more likely to be wrongfully accused of incest or sexual offending children. It's not the same I agree. But men are equally vulnerable just about other things.

Visit your local state capital, Washington DC, the executive offices of Fortune 1000 companies, etc. What do you see? Who has power in our society?

> Men are much more likely to be wrongfully accused of incest or sexual offending children.

I would be very surprised if this compares to the incidence of sexual assault. Also, men are much more likely to sexually assault women (and children), so perhaps the false accusations are proportional.

EDIT: Added last sentence of first paragraph.

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