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Microsoft announces the Surface Pro 3

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Re: Microsoft announces the Surface Pro 3

#271

Post by mwfunk »

pjmlp wrote: post #67
paperwork wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm rooting for MS. My (not so serious) test for windows is simple: the day I can resize dos command prompt as easily as terminal windows on linux/osx is the day Microsoft I need to seriously consider going back to windows :)

Properties -> Settings -> Layout -> change res -> Save. I never understood why some people make such a big fuss out of it.

The fact that you have to go into the settings to resize it IS the problem that people make a big fuss out of. You didn't offer a solution, you described the problem.

Re: Microsoft announces the Surface Pro 3

#272

Post by ghshephard »

dragontamer wrote: post #245
justin66 wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Apple has done this so well, for so long, I am pissed-off MS can't get its act together. Apple doesn't pre-announce products at all, do they? This was sloppy (Microsoft is going to have something up for preorders tomorrow, why not just put it up when the speech is finished?) but it's not something Apple even does.

Sloppy, or simply "not evil"? http://appleinsider.com/articles/09/12/15/apples_worldwide_l... The lengths at which Apple goes to prevent leaks is straight up evil. According to the source, Apple takes leaks very seriously. When a leak is suspected, a very specific protocol is followed, involving the confiscation of all cell phones and a total blackout of all unmonitored communication. "It is like a gag order, and if…

I've got a couple friends who work for Apple, and they tell me that entire story is utter fiction, they've never heard of a "Worldwide Loyalty Team" - when they read that story they thought the entire things was written in the vein of an Onion like spoof and thought it was funny that people took it seriously.

People who leak things are fired, people have to sign pretty strict NDAs, certain areas are locked off, and certain projects are restricted as to who you can talk about them with - but, that's about it. (And none of those things are completely unheard of in other companies either)

Re: Microsoft announces the Surface Pro 3

#273

Post by rdrdss23 »

simoncion wrote: post #256
rdrdss23 wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The links you gave leave the issue ambiguous. It still seems that you can't for instance launch an executable that runs cigwin in the background.

> It still seems that you can't for instance launch an executable that runs cigwin in the background. [citation needed] The corporate lawyers that I've talked to at my previous day jobs have told me that this is an obviously legal thing to do.

Just read the links that were posted.

"If the modules are included in the same executable file, they are definitely combined in one program."

Piping programs into each other is okay, but once you start bundling it's all up in the air.

Re: Microsoft announces the Surface Pro 3

#274

Post by somesay »

simoncion wrote: post #256
rdrdss23 wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The links you gave leave the issue ambiguous. It still seems that you can't for instance launch an executable that runs cigwin in the background.

> It still seems that you can't for instance launch an executable that runs cigwin in the background. [citation needed] The corporate lawyers that I've talked to at my previous day jobs have told me that this is an obviously legal thing to do.

> Piping programs into each other is okay, but once you start bundling it's all up in the air.

How does bundling mean combining it into an _executable_ file? Sure, this could be the case for an installer, but that one could also just download/copy the files.

Re: Microsoft announces the Surface Pro 3

#275

Post by joeheiniger »

thoraway wrote: post #249
iandanforth wrote: post #104

Warning, rant. Why the duck isn't there information on the Surface Pro 3 on the MS website? Apple has done this so well, for so long, I am pissed-off MS can't get its act together. You make an announcement, you need presence on the web. You need to start your customers expectations building, whet their appetite, and tease them. Their experience starts now and right now that experience is reading news articles and rea…

http://surface.microsoftstore.com/store/msusa/en_US/html/pbP... ?

If you go to microsoftstore.com it shows a giant countdown to when you can preorder the SP3 and a large banner mentioning the SP3 getting added to the Surface family. Clicking on that banner loads into the above link with all the details of the SP3 and pricing and everything.

Re: Microsoft announces the Surface Pro 3

#276

Post by vertex-four »

smrtinsert wrote: post #194
bri3d wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mean like this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Services_for_UNIX ? In my experience Cygwin works better for the "compile software targeted mostly at Linux users" use case, but Microsoft definitely pursued the "make Windows a Unix" approach. Sadly Interix saw limited adoption (probably due to pricing) and has been discontinued, so we're left with the user-space emulation approaches (like Cygwin).

They should really just buy cygwin and make it the default shell keeping powershell as optional. It's time for MS to acknowledge they need to catch up and be a little bit more interoperable with power users from other oses. cygiwn is one of the first thing i install when I bring up a new windows box.

Powershell ties in much, much better to the Windows infrastructure than any POSIX-like shell does. Managing Windows revolves around managing long-running services, and sending off requests to them which return rich data objects. This is an entirely different problem set from managing processes and files.

Modifying Windows to be administrable through a POSIX shell would change what Windows fundamentally is. I'm not sure that's a great idea.

Personally, I enjoy working with Powershell much more than I enjoy working with Linux in the traditional way (through a shell), and I currently don't personally own a Windows machine.

I don't think a shell is a very good interface for direct use; it's entirely non-discoverable past man pages. It's a great interface for developing reusable tools, though. I strongly dislike having to use it directly, preferring to develop scripts that I can access from my text editor.

As a developer, I think what you want from a shell is different from what a Windows admin wants from their shell. The Windows admin wants to manage the services they have installed; the developer wants to manage whatever files they have in their source tree. I don't think it's particularly terrible that Windows should be bundled with a tool for administrating Windows, rather than a tool for developing new software.

Re: Microsoft announces the Surface Pro 3

#277

Post by vertex-four »

bcbrown wrote: post #130
bratsche wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know you're not being serious, but there are some other terminal apps that are better than the basic DOS prompt. Check out ConEmu, for example. Now, once you've got ConEmu or something like it that will resize nicely and do other things, you'll still be stuck on the crappy DOS-style prompt though. :)

I feel similarly, and seriously. It's not so much just the usability of the command prompt, but that it would be a symbol of a change in priorities towards adding functionality for developers, and welcoming non-Windows technical audiences. If I'm using a non-built-in terminal, and a non-built-in Unix compatibility layer, why am I using Windows?

Why are you using Windows if you want it to behave like Unix?

Re: Microsoft announces the Surface Pro 3

#278

Post by Encosia »

tkmcc wrote: post #187
nmolo wrote: post #101

The only downside to this is the HD 4400 graphics unit. [1] I'm worried about it running everything smoothly at 2k. The HD 5000 is much better suited to run at that resolution. [1] http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/news/download/presskits/surfa...

My Samsung ATIV Book 9 Plus has a HD 4400 graphics unit and runs fine at 3200 x 1800, so you shouldn't have to worry unless you're doing something pretty graphically intensive.

Same here. I run graphical software like Office and Photoshop on my 3200x1800 ATIV Book 9 Plus and haven't noticed any performance issues.

Re: Microsoft announces the Surface Pro 3

#279

Post by TylerE »

vertex-four wrote: post #277
bcbrown wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel similarly, and seriously. It's not so much just the usability of the command prompt, but that it would be a symbol of a change in priorities towards adding functionality for developers, and welcoming non-Windows technical audiences. If I'm using a non-built-in terminal, and a non-built-in Unix compatibility layer, why am I using Windows?

Why are you using Windows if you want it to behave like Unix?

For me, personally: Visio and Photoshop

Re: Microsoft announces the Surface Pro 3

#280

Post by bluedino »

sliverstorm wrote: post #115
mikerg87 wrote: post #46

Small things continue to kill the surface pro acceptance: - The Surface site on the surface site hasn't updated with surface pro 3 info/pricing. The run way for this is long, why isn't the site updated or ready to go? - Accessories are notoriously out of stock. Why are they hard to get? Docking station, keyboards, mice. Fix that. - The dock has 10/100 Ethernet. In 2013-2014? Why? - Updates for firmware and drivers as…

The dock has 10/100 Ethernet. In 2013-2014? Why? Can any of the onboard hardware actually handle a 1Gbit firehose? 100Mbit is enough for any streaming you could throw at this thing.

It's not that gigabit is too much, it's that 100mb isn't enough. Pulling a file from a server at 10 megabytes per second is dreadful compare to 50 or 60
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