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Apple - Think Twice

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Re: Apple - Think Twice

#271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For laptops, there's Dell, Lenovo, ASUS, Sony, and more...a lot of them don't cost as much as Apple, but their benchmarks match up at a cheaper cost.

You're missing the point. It's not about benchmarks. That's like buying a car based on horsepower or quarter mile times. It doesn't matter as much as you'd think. It's about build quality. About vendor support. About durability. I can't be the only one disappointed that there aren't many options if those are the things you value.

Gas mileage and average life of transmission, etc. are benchmarks that do matter to the average consumer. The max horsepower isn't used at all by people purchasing cars for travel on the main roads, but max processor power is probably used at least from time to time on people purchasing computers, maybe because of running badly-written software or just trying to open a million tabs in Chrome.

Build quality/durability is quite a tough pickle to nail statstics on. Used Apple sales may still carry a higher price tag because people paid more for them in the first place, or because of the brand name. % of devices still running to their consumer's satisfaction is a statistic I haven't seen before, and might be skewed by the type of respondents. Some of the tests done here that I put stock into are actually some of the most interesting: like dropping Nintendo cartridges from 3 story buildings, or leaving a laptop in your freezer or out on the hot pavement for an hour to see what happens when you try to use them again. There are a lot of stories here about what kind of abuse their laptops take, but I would go on over to Youtube and actually look at some people who went out of their way to record this. Word of mouth and anecdotes really do dominate this area, so I can't say much about this outside of personal experience, which really comes down to "Wait at least a year, do at least an hour's research, and hope you're lucky". Even within a brand, some products are very durable while others are flimsy.

ASUS falls off that list when it comes to vendor support, but Sony, Dell and Lenovo all offer support, though I have never come across useful vendor support, so I'll have to keep quiet about that. Generally I try to buy equipment that is durable enough not to fail within that warranty period, and after that I'll move on.

Re: Apple - Think Twice

#272

I can't help but think that the majority of comments here are the loud minority. Apple's products have had faults, I'll be the first to admit. But do we really think that even 5% of Apple's millions of customers are having issues with their purchases? If that were the case, we'd see class action lawsuits against the company, the NYTimes/WSJ covering Apple's shoddy manufacturing processes, and Apple's reputation takin…

Historically, big issues with computers are related to the supply chain... poor vendor management for power supplies, defective batches of hard disks, etc.

Apple has a great supply chain, so they get dibs on the highest quality parts, etc. But, they are pushing the state of the art for manufacturing much more than they have in the past. End result: they are building difficult to repair computers. The $700 replacement of a previous gen MBP is now handing out a new, $2,500 computer from inventory at an Apple Store.

Warranty replacements reduce overall store margin, which is a key KPI for retail managers. So you're creating a situation where the local store management has an incentive to provide you with poor service. When people become victims of arbitrary and capricious behavior by a company they trust, they get angry.

Re: Apple - Think Twice

#273
post #146
post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No I'm not. I'm saying that there is no acceptable insulation in the device. The chassis for example uses air gap between the board and the base for insulation. Even condensation can bridge it, which is the theory why mine exploded. Regarding appearance, and? Does that really matter? Why you pick a ThinkPad: http://appel.hu/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/rollcage.jpg That and you can throw the damn thing across the…

Shucks. I don't even have a dog in this fight except for the following facts 1) I am a current owner of the storied T61 and 2) I have grown fond of the stupendously neat rMBP and am mulling getting one. That and you can throw the damn thing across the room and it'll still work. Mine is 5 years old, has been thrown, dropped, spilled on, yanked off the table, stood on and it's as good as new. Now that I've been made fa…

I once slipped on ice and dropped my T60p from about chest height onto a steel manhole cover. It was perfectly fine. Worrying about the structural strength of a T-series Thinkpad is entirely unjustified as far as I can tell.

Re: Apple - Think Twice

#274
post #147

I had the same problem with a rMBP. Apple replaced mine at the Apple Store even though I couldn't show them the problem while I was there. They even gave me the extra charging brick that came in the new machine's box. I have a friend with a base model rMBP who took it into the Apple Store, and they replaced his with the maxed out model because that's the only configuration they had left in stock.

"I have a friend with a base model rMBP who took it into the Apple Store, and they replaced his with the maxed out model because that's the only configuration they had left in stock." That surprised me - I was looking at an MBP purchase at an Apple Store (fairly large one, Tacoma WA). My options were only 4GB and various sizes of HDDs. They "did not" stock 8GB models, or SSD models. Not "were out of", but did not. Th…

I'm curious: do you use Linux on your Z-series? If so, how is it? Can you get the power dock thing to work?

Re: Apple - Think Twice

#275
post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The parent comment was wrong to brand its opponents fanatics, but yours is also excessively opinionated. TrackPoint versus (Apple) trackpad is, fairly obviously, a matter of taste, not of Kool-Aid.

> TrackPoint versus (Apple) trackpad is, fairly obviously, a matter of taste I don't see how it is. It's a simple matter of efficiency. When using a trackpad, you have to move your hand off of the keyboard and down several inches. When using the TrackPoint, you do not - the TrackPoint is accessible with your index finger from the keyboard's home row. All 3 mouse buttons are accessible with your thumbs while your fing…

"the TrackPoint is accessible with your index finger from the keyboard's home row"

This really, is the end of the discussion for me. After using the trackpoint for years and becoming spoiled by being able to maintain proper posture at all times, not having a trackpoint on all of my other keyboards has lead me to slowly abandon mouse use wherever possible. For me, it is a choice between either a trackpoint or nothing at all. If I had a MBP, I would disable the trackpad entirely; it would only get in my way.

Re: Apple - Think Twice

#276
Apple has always been pretty much rigid about results of their tests during repairs or replacements.

To be fair, I got almost every single part of my Macbook replaced after a surge incident that was caused internally - but I have never been able to negotiate even a repair of something trivial in cases where Apple tests fail.

They do bend over backwards for helping us out - but their tests could be very unrealistic some times.

Re: Apple - Think Twice

#277
post #60

Apple seems to have pulled back on the whole positive customer experience in store this year, I've had issues with marking below the display surface and they instantly said "not a defect, £350 please", except it looks like the tolerance on my Air is off. It's a shame, they're starting to reduce customer satisfaction in maximisation of profits, rather than increasing profits through customer satisfaction.

Maybe it has to do with the new guy who was summarily booted from the company in a year? One can hope that Cook is course-correcting.

Don't know why you're getting down voted, it's very possible that his effect is still being felt.

Re: Apple - Think Twice

#278
post #24

I wouldn't buy another Apple product either. Between a MacBook Pro which caught fire, an AirPort which melted, an iMac which the backlight went on and a MacBook which had to go back 4 times (!) due to logic board problems, it scares the shit out of me parting with that sort of cash and actually depending on it. The muppets at the "genius bar" (retard shelf as we call it now) aren't exactly helpful and usher you away…

You've had four different products that have either melted, caught fire, or suffered hardware failures? Are you sure it's not an issue with the power coming out of your outlets? Perhaps the Lenovos have better power filtering, but by the sound of it, you're pretty paranoid about those failing, too.

Re: Apple - Think Twice

#279
My wife and I both own retina Macbook Pros and, luck would have it, I got one with a Samsung display and she got one with an LG display which exhibits the ghosting issue. She had mentioned it to me in passing before, but after reading this post I talked to her about it again and low and behold, the ghosting effect was very visible in her open Emacs buffers!

So, irrationally empowered with the spirit of a wronged consumer thanks to this post, I immediately called Apple up and told them the issue.

They're sending a box in the mail next day for us to send the laptop in for a screen replacement, free of charge of course because it's under warranty.

All in all, it was a pretty painless customer service experience. I think it took all of five minutes, no exaggeration. There weren't really any questions asked, aside from "Where do you want us to send the box?". We've already ordered a temporary replacement computer for her while it's out for repair so she won't miss out on any work.

Re: Apple - Think Twice

#280
post #24

I wouldn't buy another Apple product either. Between a MacBook Pro which caught fire, an AirPort which melted, an iMac which the backlight went on and a MacBook which had to go back 4 times (!) due to logic board problems, it scares the shit out of me parting with that sort of cash and actually depending on it. The muppets at the "genius bar" (retard shelf as we call it now) aren't exactly helpful and usher you away…

As anecdotal as anecdotal evidence ever was.

Not only is it anecdotal, these sorts of discussions seem to bring all the outliers out of the woodwork. There are always going to be some people who have many bad experiences with a company, even if overall reliability is good. Here is the relevant xkcd: http://xkcd.com/882/
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