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BirdyChat becomes first European chat app that is interoperable with WhatsApp

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Re: BirdyChat becomes first European chat app that is interoperable with WhatsApp

#271

Post by mlrtime »

InsideOutSanta wrote: post #166
mcjiggerlog wrote: post #2

> With the new WhatsApp interface mandated by the DMA, any BirdyChat user in the EEA will be able to start a chat with any WhatsApp user in the region simply by knowing their phone number. Unfortunately, as it's been implemented as opt-in on WhatsApp's side, this isn't really true. Honestly that decision alone means it's kinda dead in the water.

Yep, 100% malicious compliance on Meta's part. I hope they get punished for this.

How so exactly? They can say they are keeping conversations secure from 3rd parties.

Re: BirdyChat becomes first European chat app that is interoperable with WhatsApp

#272

Post by direwolf20 »

xmcp123 wrote: post #236
palata wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The problem lies in enforcement. Unless you are a huge player, there is almost nil chance you're gonna get fined. I am curious: why is that difficult? Define the fine as a percentage of the revenue of the company, have users report links, and pay someone to check the link and send the fine. Sounds like easy money... I mean it's very profitable to pay people to check parking lots and fine drivers who don't follow th…

If I am business outside Europe, why would I send Europe what my revenue is?

I don't know — why do businesses outside Europe care about GDPR compliance at all? They could just track Europeans all they want to, without any cookie banners.

Re: BirdyChat becomes first European chat app that is interoperable with WhatsApp

#273

Post by mlrtime »

direwolf20 wrote: post #266
dmitrygr wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

old telephone lines did not disclose info about me with merely my phone number. whataspp discloses name, picture, status As for your second comment, updated first comment with: I am not even sure how this is GDPR-compliant if that app is European. They do not have my permission to have my private data, and GDPR does not allow whatAspp to hand it over without my permission either...

Several people have scraped every possible phone number from WhatsApp so they know your name, picture, and status if they want it.

So, that doesn't mean we give it away freely because someone was malicious. That makes no sense.

Re: BirdyChat becomes first European chat app that is interoperable with WhatsApp

#274

Post by neves »

computerfriend wrote: post #262
zarzavat wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The alternatives suck. WhatsApp strikes a good balance of usability and security. Telegram is too insecure (no E2E by default). Signal is too secure (no chat exports). Nobody has even bothered to make an app that stands toe-to-toe with WhatsApp, even without the network effects.

Signal has exports.

Which non hacker news user exports chats?

I'm the only person I know who ever did it.

Re: BirdyChat becomes first European chat app that is interoperable with WhatsApp

#275

Post by direwolf20 »

uyzstvqs wrote: post #250
drnick1 wrote: post #175

It would have been more effective to require Meta (and all other messaging companies) to implement an open protocol or open source theirs, so that people can freely write alternative clients free of malware.

A custom API is the only way for a platform to extend its native E2EE sessions and features to other platforms. Making those APIs completely open would become a major spam problem, which would likely end them up in the same situation as SMTP, where small servers are blocked-by-default by big providers. Interoperability by agreement between legitimate messaging services, using custom APIs is the only realistic and sec…

But WhatsApp is already completely open for spammers. They can use the secret API or screen-scrape WhatsApp itself.

Re: BirdyChat becomes first European chat app that is interoperable with WhatsApp

#276

Post by mlrtime »

xmcp123 wrote: post #234
dmitrygr wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

old telephone lines did not disclose info about me with merely my phone number. whataspp discloses name, picture, status As for your second comment, updated first comment with: I am not even sure how this is GDPR-compliant if that app is European. They do not have my permission to have my private data, and GDPR does not allow whatAspp to hand it over without my permission either...

Old telephones had caller ID. They would send your name and company. You did have to initiate the call, but you still didn’t have any kind of agreement about it.

Yes, and you used to have to pay for it! Not only was it opt-in, there was a charge.

Re: BirdyChat becomes first European chat app that is interoperable with WhatsApp

#277

Post by direwolf20 »

dmitrygr wrote: post #215
amelius wrote: post #199

When can I send messages from a PC running Python?

Hopefully - never ever ever ever ever. I do not want spam. This is why iMessage is much better than SMS - there is an implicit cost to send. This is why there is 100x (my experience) iMessage spam than SMS spam. Easy to send messages -> spam

All phone and internet services in the EU are connected to your personal identity document, similar to China. If you send spam, the police come to your house.

Re: BirdyChat becomes first European chat app that is interoperable with WhatsApp

#278

Post by mlrtime »

lxgr wrote: post #216
dmitrygr wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

old telephone lines did not disclose info about me with merely my phone number. whataspp discloses name, picture, status As for your second comment, updated first comment with: I am not even sure how this is GDPR-compliant if that app is European. They do not have my permission to have my private data, and GDPR does not allow whatAspp to hand it over without my permission either...

> whataspp discloses name, picture, status Only to who you choose to make it available to. And if you choose “everybody”, I don’t see how you can reasonably expect this to mean “everybody not using third-party software”?

Because I don't chose everybody? I don't want everyone to see my information, why would I?

Re: BirdyChat becomes first European chat app that is interoperable with WhatsApp

#279

Post by direwolf20 »

timeon wrote: post #111
rambambram wrote: post #36

As a European, I would like to know in _which_ European country you're based. I think I know all of them, people from abroad might not. Saying "Made in Europe" is too general for my European liking. ;)

Reminds me eurosky.social they have on page: "For Europe, this is our chance to build competitive alternatives to Big Tech. But we need European-hosted infrastructure to make that possibility a reality." Page is hosted in USA.

I won't understand why people do that when Hetzner is so effective.

Re: BirdyChat becomes first European chat app that is interoperable with WhatsApp

#280

Post by mlrtime »

lxgr wrote: post #220
dmitrygr wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because until today that IS what it meant! Are you claiming that "pray i do not change the deal further" is a sane approach?

I just don’t think that’s a reasonable expectation of a telecommunications tool, so yeah, I think it’s a fair change well within the norms and expectations of an instant messenger. You should get to control how/ to whom your data is distributed, but also requiring these recipients to only use software and services of your choosing seems excessive. Platform lock-in at this point seems like the much greater harm. I cou…

It's not requiring, thats the point of BirdyChat, right? You just have to opt-in to use it.
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