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Asahi Linux Still Working on Apple M3 Support, M1n1 Bootloader Going Rust

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Re: Asahi Linux Still Working on Apple M3 Support, M1n1 Bootloader Going Rust

#271

Post by ninkendo »

khamidou wrote: post #243
ninkendo wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Them saying “we’re going to pull the rug” in advance doesn’t make it not a rug pull, it just means you have advanced notice of the rug pull.

How is wanting to build software sustainably a rug pull? Like seriously, if you get value from orbstack, it's fair to pay them. Otherwise you can still stick to free alternatives like colima which would be CLI only

I think the answers pretty obvious?

A product is free. Then it isn’t free.

You can argue all day whether it’s ok to do this, and I’d absolutely say it’s fine, even laudable that they’re trying to make a real business where you have to pay for a product. Great for them!

But “rug pull” is absolutely still a correct description of what’s happening, because it was free, and now it’s not. Here’s a nice rug, but you have to get off of it by $DATE because we’re going to pull it. It’s a rug pull.

If it wasn’t a rug pull, I’d be able to keep standing on the rug (the free version.)

Re: Asahi Linux Still Working on Apple M3 Support, M1n1 Bootloader Going Rust

#272

Post by ninkendo »

Teever wrote: post #262
ninkendo wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Them saying “we’re going to pull the rug” in advance doesn’t make it not a rug pull, it just means you have advanced notice of the rug pull.

Isn't an intrinsic part of a rug pull deception?

Says who?

Re: Asahi Linux Still Working on Apple M3 Support, M1n1 Bootloader Going Rust

#273

Post by phpnode »

mort96 wrote: post #266
phpnode wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, sorry I misread what you wrote. The question stands though

I mean I already answered that, didn't I? I find it worse to buy from the explicitly political pro-fascist company than to buy from the "normal company" which just "incidentally" benefit fascist governments through their normal business operations. To exaggerate, we could imagine that there was an explicitly nazi computer manufacturer who put swastika stickers on their laptops and everything. When faced with the choi…

Thanks for bearing with me, I am sincerely trying to understand your mindset here.

So this is really a signalling thing? If you bought a Framework laptop you'd be signalling to your peers that you're ambivalent about supporting an ideology that obviously you fundamentally disagree with and is unanimously despised within your groups?

Re: Asahi Linux Still Working on Apple M3 Support, M1n1 Bootloader Going Rust

#274

Post by ac29 »

koiueo wrote: post #116
mort96 wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should look into the political views of Omarchy's creator and sole developer, DHH

I tried, and all I found was some hearsay. Ethical concerns were raised by many publications without any specifics. Some mention the issue is building on top of hyprland, which (oh god, no) has some ethical issues. I couldn't find anything specific. Would appreciate a link to any based explanation

DHH made a blog post in which he implied (but did not state) that the UK isnt white enough anymore. Its gross and racist, but as far as I know this is all there is to the current controversy around him.

If you want to read the post, its here: https://web.archive.org/web/20250925050154/https://world.hey...

Re: Asahi Linux Still Working on Apple M3 Support, M1n1 Bootloader Going Rust

#275

Post by notepad0x90 »

dangus wrote: post #180
notepad0x90 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think any other competitor makes hardware of a similar class in terms of quality. Framework is great, but it doesn't even come close in terms of quality. Specs are one thing, how the product looks, feels, attention to detail, and most importantly: long term viability! even if you take away everything else, macbooks are though. I've used a couple for over a decade with no hardware repair (except when I broke a…

I can’t believe you’re gaslighting us all by claiming “long term viability” is better on a MacBook, a system with zero user-replaceable components, a glued-in battery, soldered-in memory, etc. A MacBook loses software updates in 10 years. Sometimes less. You can install what amounts to reverse engineered Linux on one if you lose your macOS updates. You have a choice of basically one viable distro. And this idea that…

The screen repair was like $150. I've had framebooks and they broke within 3 years from hardware failures. macbooks going strong a decade+. You can repair framework, you usually don't have to with a mac. Plus, for people who can't repair their own pc, apple's support is better than framework,dell,etc.

and please ffs, stop misusing the term "gaslight". someone having a different opinion and experience than you is not the same gaslighting you. gaslighting is when someone blames you for a harm they themselves caused. it isn't even possible for me to gaslight you in this context since the harm caused can only come from apple or someone making you use apple products.

> And this idea that no other competitor makes hardware in a similar class of quality is extremely outdated.

You might be right, but framework isn't it. We're having this discussion to better inform each other, so what laptop do you recommend that has a similar build quality as an MBP?

Re: Asahi Linux Still Working on Apple M3 Support, M1n1 Bootloader Going Rust

#276

Post by rowanG077 »

fluoridation wrote: post #163
wyager wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For the vast majority of customers' utility functions, Apple has the best hardware (both in absolute and per dollar terms) on the market right now. It's not "objectively best", but it certainly meets the most stringent definition of "best" that's still useful in conversation.

If that was the case, the vast majority of the world would be using Apple hardware and/or software, and yet that's not the case.

Not really, price is still extremely important and doesn't really factor into the definition of the best product. Taken to the extreme, Imagine a laptop a thousand times faster then the best there is now, with an extremely bright HDR screen with perfect blacks and a 1000hz refresh rate. It has a battery life of years, It's made of an unscratchable metal alloy and is fanless. It runs windows, linux and macos flawlessly. It's CPU can natively executable all major instruction sets. It's extremely light. Yet it costs 50 million USD. Sure there will be some super rich who may buy it. But never will the majority of the world use it.

Re: Asahi Linux Still Working on Apple M3 Support, M1n1 Bootloader Going Rust

#277

Post by mort96 »

phpnode wrote: post #273
mort96 wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean I already answered that, didn't I? I find it worse to buy from the explicitly political pro-fascist company than to buy from the "normal company" which just "incidentally" benefit fascist governments through their normal business operations. To exaggerate, we could imagine that there was an explicitly nazi computer manufacturer who put swastika stickers on their laptops and everything. When faced with the choi…

Thanks for bearing with me, I am sincerely trying to understand your mindset here. So this is really a signalling thing? If you bought a Framework laptop you'd be signalling to your peers that you're ambivalent about supporting an ideology that obviously you fundamentally disagree with and is unanimously despised within your groups?

By buying a Framework laptop I'm signaling to Framework that I don't care about their support of the ideology. My ideal outcome here would be that Framework's support of DHH would directly and unambiguously result in a dramatic loss of sales, which would signal to the world that supporting such ideologies is toxic to your brand.

And, sure, my peers play a role too. What message do I send, for example, to my transgender friends when I demonstrate that I don't mind Framework's public support of DHH's public transphobic rhetoric? What message do I send to my non-white friends when I demonstrate that I don't mind Framework's public support of DHH's public "the UK was better when it was all white" rhetoric? Et cetera.

Re: Asahi Linux Still Working on Apple M3 Support, M1n1 Bootloader Going Rust

#278

Post by tgma »

giancarlostoro wrote: post #257
tgma wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All of these things are running Linux under virtualization and faking it to the Mac user and they naturally have all the same limitations as running a VM. They are effectively like WSL. P.S. I believe that specific company did some level of rug-pull early on already and started charging people who already relied on it for free because they left Docker which started charging earlier, so I would be vary of relying on t…

> They are effectively like WSL. You mean WSL2. WSL1 was more like Wine than a VM. I am still sour they did away with that approach, I thought it was the coolest thing.

> You mean WSL2.

Yes, indeed.

> I thought it was the coolest thing.

NT was designed to have different subsystems[1]. Win32 subsystem was a layer on top of NT, and was a peer to the POSIX subsystem, and IIRC even OS/2. WSL1 ideas was certainly not new in the context of NT. FreeBSD also has a Linux subsystem.

[1]: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5d/Wi...

Re: Asahi Linux Still Working on Apple M3 Support, M1n1 Bootloader Going Rust

#279

Post by monocasa »

tgma wrote: post #278
giancarlostoro wrote: post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They are effectively like WSL. You mean WSL2. WSL1 was more like Wine than a VM. I am still sour they did away with that approach, I thought it was the coolest thing.

> You mean WSL2. Yes, indeed. > I thought it was the coolest thing. NT was designed to have different subsystems[1]. Win32 subsystem was a layer on top of NT, and was a peer to the POSIX subsystem, and IIRC even OS/2. WSL1 ideas was certainly not new in the context of NT. FreeBSD also has a Linux subsystem. [1]: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5d/Wi...

WSL was orthogonal to NT subsystems however.

It was implemented as an NT "Pico Process", which was a pretty new concept in NT.

Re: Asahi Linux Still Working on Apple M3 Support, M1n1 Bootloader Going Rust

#280

Post by fluoridation »

rowanG077 wrote: post #276
fluoridation wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If that was the case, the vast majority of the world would be using Apple hardware and/or software, and yet that's not the case.

Not really, price is still extremely important and doesn't really factor into the definition of the best product. Taken to the extreme, Imagine a laptop a thousand times faster then the best there is now, with an extremely bright HDR screen with perfect blacks and a 1000hz refresh rate. It has a battery life of years, It's made of an unscratchable metal alloy and is fanless. It runs windows, linux and macos flawlessl…

>price is still extremely important and doesn't really factor into the definition of the best

Heh. Who says it doesn't?

>Taken to the extreme, Imagine [...]

Okay. Likewise, imagine a computer exactly like you've described, except it costs five cents and measures a cubic kilometer. Sure, there may be a couple people for whom operating such a gigantic machine is no problem, but the vast majority of the world will never use it. So the size of the computer also doesn't factor into whether it's "the best", right? And so on for any single property you care to name.

Yeah, no. The price is as much a part of a product as its physical shape. If Macs cost about the same as non-Macs, maybe they'd the most popular computers in the world, but they're not. And even in that case, they would not be the best. If, say, the program I need to run doesn't run on a Mac, the best computer for me would not be a Mac, it would be whatever computer is able to run it.

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