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Willow quantum chip demonstrates verifiable quantum advantage on hardware

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Re: Willow quantum chip demonstrates verifiable quantum advantage on hardware

#271

Post by andy_ppp »

johncolanduoni wrote: post #265
tczMUFlmoNk wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> public key of a wallet (present on any outgoing transaction in the ledger) Genuine question: is this true? I only know a little bit about Bitcoin, but I thought there was a notion of an "extended public key" that's not exposed to the ledger, where each individual public key on the ledger is only used once, or something like that. I'm not at all confident in my understanding, so I'd love if you or someone else knowl…

Extended public keys can be used to generate a family of addresses, but each transaction still needs the public key for any address that has sent money. Someone who uses it religiously can keep most of their money in addresses with no outgoing transactions, meaning their public key is actually secret and therefore cannot be attacked. But there’s so many addresses that have outgoing transactions and huge balances that…

The real issue is as soon as this is done once Bitcoin's value plummets to a fraction of what it was today while people scramble to fix the algorithms.

Re: Willow quantum chip demonstrates verifiable quantum advantage on hardware

#272

Post by Libidinalecon »

bottlepalm wrote: post #195
IAmGraydon wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every time I mention quantum computing as a threat to crypto (which I have been for years), I get downvoted to oblivion. I guess we have a lot of HODLers here. A bet on crypto is a bet against quantum computing.

Unless advances in QC could rewrite the blockchain then there's not much to worry about. If the crypto algorithms are compromised, you coins are pretty much frozen on the chain until a new algorithms are implemented. Are you're arguing QC makes signatures/verification/mining impossible?

Before things were frozen you would have the biggest crash in market history. Then it would be like a futures market that has gone limit down. The panic during this time would be unbelievable. Then when it reopens it would crash further and effectively end trust in crypto.

Re: Willow quantum chip demonstrates verifiable quantum advantage on hardware

#273

Post by fwip »

AlanYx wrote: post #253
fwip wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To me, it matters because it's a sign that it might not be particularly transferable as a method of computation. A wind tunnel is a great tool for solving aerodynamics and fluid flow problems, more efficiently than a typical computer. But we don't call it a wind-computer, because it's not a useful tool outside of that narrow domain. The promise of quantum computing is that it can solve useful problems outside the qua…

I really like the wind tunnel example. That's a good way of explaining this to people. I wonder whether discussions over quantum advantage would be clearer if we split it into two concepts: (i) algorithmic quantum advantage and (ii) physical quantum advantage? The former would be for quantum computers that are reconfigurable in some sense to implement algorithms.

Thanks. My first analogy was "a giant configurable pachinko machine you could use to simulate other pachinko machines," but thankfully the wind tunnel occurred to me halfway through writing the post.

Re: Willow quantum chip demonstrates verifiable quantum advantage on hardware

#274

Post by jwpapi »

strbean wrote: post #103
jwpapi wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not even needed you can just copy network state of a specific moment in time and encrypt with a new algorithm that will be used from then on

The problem is that the owner needs to claim their wallet and migrate it to the new encryption. Just freezing the state at a specific moment doesn't help; to claim the wallet in the new system I just need the private key for the old wallet (as that's the sole way to prove ownership). In our hypothetical post-quantum scenario, anyone with a quantum computer can get the private key and migrate the wallet, becoming the…

Yes obviously that has to happen before authentication doesnt work anymore. And then it also needs to end before, because yeah obviously everybody who can crack it has access to all wallets.

Re: Willow quantum chip demonstrates verifiable quantum advantage on hardware

#275

Post by XiphiasX »

janpmz wrote: post #244
XiphiasX wrote: post #242

Genuine question - why is Bitcoin not collapsing upon this news? Surely big money that control Bitcoin have high enough IQ to extrapolate inti the future and come to decision on the inevitable implications.

The critics claim the noise collapses quantum states so quickly that it's not possible to make full use of the quantum effects. The burden of proof is on the chip makers. I think they have not convinced the critics yet.

Smart money knows quantum will crack Bitcoin. Why is Bitcoin not crashing?

Re: Willow quantum chip demonstrates verifiable quantum advantage on hardware

#276

Post by rkomorn »

XiphiasX wrote: post #275
janpmz wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The critics claim the noise collapses quantum states so quickly that it's not possible to make full use of the quantum effects. The burden of proof is on the chip makers. I think they have not convinced the critics yet.

Smart money knows quantum will crack Bitcoin. Why is Bitcoin not crashing?

Because smart money thinks they can be the last seller before the crash.

Re: Willow quantum chip demonstrates verifiable quantum advantage on hardware

#277

Post by r33b33 »

andrewla wrote: post #61
bilsbie wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t see why bitcoin wouldn’t update its software in such a case. The majority of minors just need to agree. But why wouldn’t they if the alternative is going to zero?

How could updating the software possibly make a difference here? If the encryption is cracked, then who is to say who owns which Bitcoin? As soon as I try to transfer any coin that I own, I expose my public key, your "Quantum Computer" cracks it, and you offer a competing transaction with a higher fee to send the Bitcoin to your slush fund. No amount of software fixes can update this. In theory once an attack becomes…

Surely top Bitcoin holders know this... so, why hasn't it crashed yet? Explain please.

Re: Willow quantum chip demonstrates verifiable quantum advantage on hardware

#278

Post by r33b33 »

LarsDu88 wrote: post #38
ransom1538 wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

SO... BTC goes to zero?

If quantum computers crack digital crytography, traditional bank account goes to zero too because regular 'ol databases also use crytography techniques for communication.

This is WRONG and a very common stupid belief. Traditional banks will just transfer easily to safer encryption, since they are centralised. Bitcoin won't. Bitcoin will die and world will undergo infinite suffering.

Re: Willow quantum chip demonstrates verifiable quantum advantage on hardware

#279

Post by r33b33 »

andrewla wrote: post #61
bilsbie wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t see why bitcoin wouldn’t update its software in such a case. The majority of minors just need to agree. But why wouldn’t they if the alternative is going to zero?

How could updating the software possibly make a difference here? If the encryption is cracked, then who is to say who owns which Bitcoin? As soon as I try to transfer any coin that I own, I expose my public key, your "Quantum Computer" cracks it, and you offer a competing transaction with a higher fee to send the Bitcoin to your slush fund. No amount of software fixes can update this. In theory once an attack becomes…

> How could updating the software possibly make a difference here? If the encryption is cracked, then who is to say who owns which Bitcoin? As soon as I try to transfer any coin that I own, I expose my public key, your "Quantum Computer" cracks it, and you offer a competing transaction with a higher fee to send the Bitcoin to your slush fund.

So if this understood knowledge, it means you cannot really transfer to quantum safe algo for Bitcoin. Are we only ones aware of this? Because if this true, it's actual alpha and Bitcoin should be sold asap and exchanged for land and physical gold.

Am I wrong here?

Re: Willow quantum chip demonstrates verifiable quantum advantage on hardware

#280

Post by smeej »

bloppe wrote: post #123
andrewla wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How could updating the software possibly make a difference here? If the encryption is cracked, then who is to say who owns which Bitcoin? As soon as I try to transfer any coin that I own, I expose my public key, your "Quantum Computer" cracks it, and you offer a competing transaction with a higher fee to send the Bitcoin to your slush fund. No amount of software fixes can update this. In theory once an attack becomes…

> would require all holders (not miners) to actively update their wallets. Basically infeasible. It doesn't require all holders to update their wallets. Some people would fail to do so and lose their money. That doesn't mean the rest of the network can't do anything to save themselves. Most people use hosted wallets like Coinbase these days anyway, and Coinbase would certainly be on top of things. Also, you don't nee…

Sometimes there is no valid hash found for any nonces in the 2^32 space and the timestamp and/or the extra nonce in the coinbase transaction in the block header have to be updated and tried again, so at least it's not quite that simple (simple, as distinct from easy).
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