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Malicious compliance by booking an available meeting room

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Re: Malicious compliance by booking an available meeting room

#271

Post by daveatwork »

taneq wrote: post #263
bumby wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You seem to expect the professor to give you a reasonable accommodation for an affliction you didn’t even realize you had. If you want to hold him accountable for his (unfair?) rules, you need to first hold yourself accountable for getting the disease diagnosed.

Maybe we should just be a little lenient to everyone, on principle?

What of the ADD student who gets distracted when someone comes in late? What should we tell them. "Suck it up"

What of the daycare that's expecting you to show up and pick up your kids on time. Should we tell the workers to wait, because the guy replacing you at work was late. Then of course we tell the cleaners of the daycare to start their shift 30 mins later because they have to wait for the last kid to leave. Oh and the cleaners will have to stay 30 min extra to clean, so now we tell the people relying on them to wait. Or.. Or we tell the cleaners to work a bit harder so they don't take an extra 30 minutes..

So the 30min you're late messes up the day of not just the person expecting you, but all the people expecting them.

How about on principle anticipate that you're going to be late, and make an effort to arrive early. If you know you're late all the time, start giving yourself more time.

Re: Malicious compliance by booking an available meeting room

#272

Post by hammock »

Stratoscope wrote: post #194
mandevil wrote: post #174

A scoutmaster of mine had a theory. Everyone has their own different version of what "9:30" means- to some it's 9:25, to others 9:45. But there is only one 9:32. So he would use weird times like that, we're meeting at 6:07 today.

Saratoga, CA does something similar. The twisty part of Quito Road, between Bicknell Road and Pollard road, has a speed limit of 25 mph. But the sharper turns have advisory speed signs (the yellow diamond kind) with numbers like 17, 19, 21, and 22 mph to catch drivers' attention and get them to slow down on these turns.

Then there’s an aggressive driver who sees that and realizes it hammers home the point that the yellow speed signs (vs the white ones) are not enforceable.

And an enforceable sign could never be a weird number because speedos don’t have ticks but every 5mph.

Re: Malicious compliance by booking an available meeting room

#273

Post by shakna »

Aeolun wrote: post #264
shakna wrote: post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The world we live in, with the people we live with, require accomodations every single day. Not locking a door allows the students who were delayed on the road by a car accident, as much as the disabled student who took five minutes longer than expected after falling down some stairs. Every single person makes mistakes at times. If those are not absorbed by flexibility, then they go on to affect everyone else connect…

It also allows the people actually in the class a lesson uninterrupted by random people for variety of good/bad reasons. Most 90% of students is not late on any given day. Should they all be penalized for the actions of a few?

So you're happy to punish 10% of students, for no fault of their own. You'll trade a moment's distraction, for a paid-for day's learning.

That, is a lack of empathy. Especially as for about the last hundred years universities have had a process that allows for the necessary flexibility.

To take this to the extreme... Should we simply fire everyone who is late to work, without reason? If someone else causes a car accident, should we simply revoke the licenses of everyone involved, regardless?

Re: Malicious compliance by booking an available meeting room

#274

Post by degamad »

Aeolun wrote: post #264
shakna wrote: post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The world we live in, with the people we live with, require accomodations every single day. Not locking a door allows the students who were delayed on the road by a car accident, as much as the disabled student who took five minutes longer than expected after falling down some stairs. Every single person makes mistakes at times. If those are not absorbed by flexibility, then they go on to affect everyone else connect…

It also allows the people actually in the class a lesson uninterrupted by random people for variety of good/bad reasons. Most 90% of students is not late on any given day. Should they all be penalized for the actions of a few?

The request is not to transfer the burden onto the 90%, but to design a system where the 10% are able to participate without impeding the 90%.

For example, if students enter from the rear of the room, then delayed students can join without disrupting the on-time students.

If we start the design process with the awareness that some students will be late, then we can design systems which support all students.

Re: Malicious compliance by booking an available meeting room

#275

Post by daveatwork »

bumby wrote: post #246
gnfargbl wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You seem to expect the professor to give you a reasonable accommodation for an affliction you didn’t even realize you had. No. How could he? Instead, I'm pointing out the value of empathy, tolerance and flexibility.

I’m all for empathy, tolerance, and flexibility (to a reasonable degree). I also don’t think it’s reasonable to expect a professor to act on an assumption of illness when the person actually experiencing the symptoms does not hold that assumption. Your perspective makes it seem like the prof is privy to information about your health that you don’t have.

I'd go a step further.. The prof was expressing empathy for the students that made the effort to be on time. They made it.

If you know you're late all the time, then make allowances. 8 hours not enough sleep, go to bed earlier. 1 hour not enough time to wake up, set your alarm to give you 2 hours.

This isn't related to knowing you're sick, just knowing you're late often.

It always makes me wonder when I hear "empathy, tolerance, flexibility" pointed at a group of 30 or more, who need to work around one persons inability to do the same.

I had a co-worker who was always late. I told her she was lying when she said she'd be there at 2. She got miffed. I replied. "You're late so often, do you expect you'll be on time. I know you'll try, but do you really believe you're not going to be late." She paused. "If you know you're very likely going to be late and tell me you will be somewhere at time X, then you are lying."

Re: Malicious compliance by booking an available meeting room

#277

Post by innomatics »

aag wrote: post #276

I once kicked Larry Page himself out of a meeting room because he had run over. I admired him for not making a special case for himself.

Good on you.

I've always thought that the preparedness of employees to boot seniors out of their booked meeting rooms was a bellwether of good corporate culture. Places that values everyone's time and leaders follow process by example.

Re: Malicious compliance by booking an available meeting room

#278

Post by outworlder »

bumby wrote: post #246
gnfargbl wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You seem to expect the professor to give you a reasonable accommodation for an affliction you didn’t even realize you had. No. How could he? Instead, I'm pointing out the value of empathy, tolerance and flexibility.

I’m all for empathy, tolerance, and flexibility (to a reasonable degree). I also don’t think it’s reasonable to expect a professor to act on an assumption of illness when the person actually experiencing the symptoms does not hold that assumption. Your perspective makes it seem like the prof is privy to information about your health that you don’t have.

You are being purposely obtuse.

Illness is only one of the possible issues a student may have that may be impacting them. A little flexibility goes a long way.

Re: Malicious compliance by booking an available meeting room

#280

Post by urbandw311er »

lazyasciiart wrote: post #251
leviathant wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I started replying "No agenda, no attenda" after being in a few too many meetings where things dragged on, or where I clearly was not needed. Didn't matter if I was telling this to someone at the same level as me, or someone at the head of the department: the humor in the wording lessens the sting of the implied "stop being disorganized" message. I made it clear that if there was not a clear agenda in the meeting inv…

I tried this once and my manager and skip level explained to me that sometimes it's necessary to make people get together in case anyone wanted to talk about something, not every meeting needs an agenda. Unsurprisingly, I was not a good fit for that team.

That is so terribly inefficient it makes me physically anxious.
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