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We're building a dystopia just to make people click on ads [video]

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Re: We're building a dystopia just to make people click on ads [video]

#271

Post by MichaelZuo »

Imustaskforhelp wrote: post #250
MichaelZuo wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would you spend any amount of time at all on a website that you’ve observed to serve known fraud ads for more than a week or two (and hasn’t sacked their advertising provider)?

Because its a monopoly? Its name is youtube. And For the record, I am already using ad blockers but on some very rare occasions on when I don't somehow, its absolutely nightmare

So then how would your complaints be meaningful?

Have you identified some way for youtube to lose it’s monopoly status?

Re: We're building a dystopia just to make people click on ads [video]

#272

Post by int_19h »

ethbr1 wrote: post #265
int_19h wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're correct that the main thing enabled by JS is partial updates, but the fact that it relies on JS is IMO itself in large part due to path dependent evolution (i.e. JS was there and could be used for that, so that's what we standardized on). Imagine instead if HTML evolved more in the direction of enabling this exact scenario out of the box. So that e.g. you could declaratively mark a button or a link as triggeri…

When that data streams in though, how is a developer defining what it changes? Or in this hypothetical is the remote server always directly sending HTML?

I was thinking more along the latter lines - i.e. the link/button would specify the ID of the element to update, and it would be replaced with the received HTML.

If we're unwinding back to early 00s though, it could also be fetching XML from the server and then running it through the XSLT stylesheet associated with the current document to convert it to HTML, to reduce the amount of data on the wire.

The specifics could be debated here. But I'm pretty sure that a generic mechanism could be devised that'd adequately cover many use cases that require JS today.

Re: We're building a dystopia just to make people click on ads [video]

#273

Post by sssilver »

sdoering wrote: post #252
sssilver wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because when you're the sole owner and provider of goods, advertisement loses all meaning. I grew up in the Soviet Union. There was one type of milk on the shelf, it was called "Milk", and I don't remember the label saying anything else. Compare with "HORIZON ORGANIC DHA Omega-3 Supports the Brain Health organic Whole Milk" dressed in bright red and contrasting yellow, with typography that begs "please look at me, I'…

Yeah but dropping advertising (or regulating it) does not necessarily imply a monopoly in terms of who provides what. That what I wanted to understand. I understand the other way around, that a socialist panned economy with monopolies in terms of who produces what is shit. And leads to advertising not being necessary. But the other way round is what still trips me off and what I am still not able to wrap my head arou…

How do you regulate advertising without severely restricting freedom of speech?

Communism seems like the only reasonable way — at least then you’re only restricting your own speech as the entity who produces these things.

Re: We're building a dystopia just to make people click on ads [video]

#274

Post by bigyabai »

ToucanLoucan wrote: post #116
latency-guy2 wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is that a "step 1" when thats describing something else entirely? How much would you pay to own an account on social media? If your answer is $0 then you're not addressing anything, you just want someone else to subsidize your entertainment and you want to call the shots on top. I don't work for free, and I know damn well neither do you.

> How is that a "step 1" when thats describing something else entirely? You asked "how do we change that" and I'm assuming the "that" referred to the subject of the PC: "The damage of an advertising-based internet economy" which in turn exists in the context of the linked video in the OP, which enunciates the consequences of machine learning being applied to creating hyper-addictive and extremist social media website…

> You asked "how do we change that"

He did not, you are ascribing another person's quote to them.

> And the principle issue there is thus: an algorithm

Section 230 does not stop people from using algorithms to enforce harmful content consumption loops for the purposes of selling advertisements. It specifically protects them from the consequences, but repeal that and now you've created a common incentive to sell Cocomelon for American adults.

We keep Section 230 because, even when it's retards like Elon Musk at the reigns, adults deserve to be treated with maturity and respect.

Re: We're building a dystopia just to make people click on ads [video]

#275

Post by genewitch »

dest wrote: post #146
jorgesborges wrote: post #81

Is it possible to launch an offensive against advertising by spoofing humans that consume ads so numbers increase so dramatically they’re meaningless?

Check AdNauseam!

Yes this works great. I wonder why chrome disabled it repeatedly?

Re: We're building a dystopia just to make people click on ads [video]

#276

Post by kjkjadksj »

c-hendricks wrote: post #241
kjkjadksj wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ublock origin is more than an adblocker. You can target entire site elements you don’t like loading. Screw it, delete the entire youtube recommendations sidebar and live in bliss. Is it possible to learn this power? Not from a Jedi.

"Use Distraction Control in Safari to hide items on a webpage" https://support.apple.com/en-ca/120682

You can roll your own filter regex to catch future similar elements as well in ublock origin. Way more powerful. I’d figure HN users would want the actual reigns.

Re: We're building a dystopia just to make people click on ads [video]

#277

Post by genewitch »

lawrenceyan wrote: post #212

If everyone had a Solana wallet, and ads were natively integrated, you'd receive $0.10 for every one you watch. Consumers right now only get monetized. They see zero return from their attention being taken away from them.

And who or what decides how many ads I can watch a day? What if I have 100 VMs running Firefox and all of them are just clicking ads all day?

Will they still show me ads even if I've exhausted my "solana payments" for the day?

Re: We're building a dystopia just to make people click on ads [video]

#278

Post by const_cast »

antfarm wrote: post #35
lukev wrote: post #33

Half the comments here are just pointing out that ad blockers exist, which is missing the point. The damage of an advertising-based internet economy is not limited to just "seeing ads." The entire content and structure of the internet is warped around this economy. Search engines, SEO, content discovery mechanisms, types and variety of content... all could have been different and better.

But how are you going to change that?

The same way we actually have been fixing problems for the past few hundred years: legislation.

Spooky, I know, but contrary to what armchair economists will tell you, the invisible hand doesn't do shit outside what it needs to. It's a lot like Natural Selection in that way. Yeah it works... to get the job done. And nothing more. Because it doesn't need to.

Re: We're building a dystopia just to make people click on ads [video]

#279

Post by Imustaskforhelp »

jama211 wrote: post #259
MichaelZuo wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would you spend any amount of time at all on a website that you’ve observed to serve known fraud ads for more than a week or two (and hasn’t sacked their advertising provider)?

If you actually lived your life like this you wouldn’t be on any website other than Wikipedia. Surely you don’t _actually_ live your life like this despite your tone that suggests it would be crazy to live your life any other way?

most of the time I have an adblocker so I rarely see ads on internet, but I am a little pissed when I see them. Makes me show the reality that all we are is a number to these sites. Something my brain doesn't like.

Re: We're building a dystopia just to make people click on ads [video]

#280

Post by skygazer »

kjkjadksj wrote: post #276
c-hendricks wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Use Distraction Control in Safari to hide items on a webpage" https://support.apple.com/en-ca/120682

You can roll your own filter regex to catch future similar elements as well in ublock origin. Way more powerful. I’d figure HN users would want the actual reigns.

I use 1Blocker with Safari, and I create custom regex/css blocking rules all the time, and as a bonus, they auto sync between desktop and mobile. Also, the rules update independent of the extension. I'm not aware of experiencing the purported downsides some folks dogmatically cite in this thread. I'm happy to learn the error of my ways, but only if it's real.
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