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Synology Lost the Plot with Hard Drive Locking Move

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Re: Synology Lost the Plot with Hard Drive Locking Move

#271

Post by spease »

netruk44 wrote: post #249
yurishimo wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think anyone would care if Synology gave priority to their own drives. A checkbox during setup that says “Yes, I know I’m using these drives that have not been validated blah blah blah” would be plenty. That’s not what Synology did however and that’s the main reason everyone is pissed.

Funny you mention that… I have a DS1515+ which has an SSD cache function that uses a whitelisted set of known good drives that function well. If you plug in a non whitelisted ssd and try to use it as a cache, it pops up a stern warning about potential data loss due to unsupported drives with a checkbox to acknowledge that you’re okay with the risk. So…there’s really no excuse why they couldn’t have done this for regu…

That assumes that the person setting up the NAS is the same person using it, which is not going to be the case for non-tech-savvy users.

Everyone will understand it costing more, fewer people will understand why the NAS ate their data without the warning it was supposed to provide, because cheap drives that didn’t support certain metrics were used.

If Synology wants to have there be only one way that the device behaves, they have to put constraints on the hardware.

Re: Synology Lost the Plot with Hard Drive Locking Move

#272

Post by akx »

MrDrMcCoy wrote: post #165
gambiting wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

....do you think the drive doesn't know where the empty space actually is?

Drives blindly store and retrieve blocks wherever you tell them, with no awareness of how or if they relate to one another. It's a filesystem's job to keep track of what's where. Filesystems get fragmented over time, and especially as they get full. The more full they get, the more seeking and shuffling they have to do to find a place to write stuff. This will be the case even after the last spinning drive rusts out,…

Not quite, AFAIK? Drive controllers may internally remap blocks to physical disk blocks (e.g. when a bad sector is detected; see the SMART attribute Reallocated Sector Count).

Re: Synology Lost the Plot with Hard Drive Locking Move

#273

Post by Zekio »

Hamuko wrote: post #268
adam_th wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unraid is brilliant if you're interested in BYO hardware. It can be setup with mix and match drives, supports docker and virtual machines. Realistically it's a bit more work than Synology to get up and running, but once it is, the only thing you really need to do is update the software from time to time

I've heard things about Unraid not being that performant due to the design of the disk array solution.

you can run ZFS without the Unraid disk array in unraid these days

Re: Synology Lost the Plot with Hard Drive Locking Move

#274

Post by kxrm »

apetrovic wrote: post #208
Renaud wrote: post #90

Synology isn't about the NAS hardware and OS. Once setup, it doesn't really matter as long as your config is reliable and fast, so there are many competitive options to move to. The killer feature for me is the app ecosystem. I have a very old 8-bay Synology NAS and have it setup in just a few clicks to backup my dropbox, my MS365 accounts, my Google business accounts, do redundant backup to external drive, backup im…

What are "competitive options"? It's a genuine question. Before Synology, I had some DIY server in a Fractal Design case, and noise and, to be honest, bulk were a problem. Also, maintenance of the server wasn't funny. I switched to Synology about six years ago (918+). The box is small, quiet, and easy to put in the rack together with the network gear. I started with 4TB drives, gradually switched to 8TB over time (dr…

Kind of surprising, I went the other way. I started out with ReadyNAS 15 years ago and after that product faded due to lack of support I no longer wanted to be tied down to a manufacturer. I built a custom solution using a U-Nas chassis. Found FreeNAS back in the day and have stuck with it ever since. Maintenance is fairly minimal.

If you heavily rely on apps/services. I've just gone to self managed docker environments for things like that. A very simple script runs updates.

Re: Synology Lost the Plot with Hard Drive Locking Move

#275

Post by Shank »

I personally think that in 2025, you should treat the NAS as a purely storage product and buy your hardware from that perspective. TrueNAS or UniFi’s new NAS product fulfill that goal. From there, supplement your NAS with a Mac Mini or other mini-PC for storage-adjacent tasks.

Synology’s whole business model (arguably QNAP’s too) depends on you wanting more drive bays than 2 and wanting to host apps and similar services. The premium they ask is substantial. You can spec out a beefy Dell PowerEdge with a ton of drive bays for cheap and install TrueNAS, and you’ll likely be much happier.

But the fundamental suggestion I make is to consider a NAS a storage-only product. If you push it to be an app and VM server too, you’re dependent on these relatively closed ecosystems and subject to the whims of the ecosystem owner. Synology choosing to lock out drives is just one example. Their poor encryption support (arbitrary limitations on file filenames or strange full-disk encryption choices) is another. If you dive into any system like Synology long enough, you’ll find warts that ultimately you wouldn’t face if you just used more specialized software than what the NAS world provides.

Re: Synology Lost the Plot with Hard Drive Locking Move

#276

Post by shantara »

Renaud wrote: post #90

Synology isn't about the NAS hardware and OS. Once setup, it doesn't really matter as long as your config is reliable and fast, so there are many competitive options to move to. The killer feature for me is the app ecosystem. I have a very old 8-bay Synology NAS and have it setup in just a few clicks to backup my dropbox, my MS365 accounts, my Google business accounts, do redundant backup to external drive, backup im…

I’m running two Synology NAS devices, and I wouldn’t consider their app ecosystem to be their strong point. I started by trying to take advantage of the built-in Synology apps when I first got my NAS, but quickly realized how limited they are. Their bi-directional synchronization solution is so slow and archaic compared Syncthing! And the same is true for most of their software offerings. At this point, I’m happy with having Docker support, and don’t particularly care about the rest of their apps.

I still appreciate how easy and maintenance-free was their implementation of the core NAS functionality. I do have a Linux desktop for experiments and playing around with, but I prefer to have all of my actually important data to be on a separate rock solid device. Previously, Synology fulfilled this role and was worth paying for, but if this policy goes live, I wouldn’t consider them fro my next NAS.

Re: Synology Lost the Plot with Hard Drive Locking Move

#277

Post by qsi »

Renaud wrote: post #90

Synology isn't about the NAS hardware and OS. Once setup, it doesn't really matter as long as your config is reliable and fast, so there are many competitive options to move to. The killer feature for me is the app ecosystem. I have a very old 8-bay Synology NAS and have it setup in just a few clicks to backup my dropbox, my MS365 accounts, my Google business accounts, do redundant backup to external drive, backup im…

This is sad... I've been using Synology for a very long time (over 15 years?) and have been pretty happy with my experience. The one time I needed their tech support also left me with a good impression...

This however is a deal breaker for me as I'd hate to be locked in to their drives for all the reasons in TFA but also as a matter of principle.

I hope Synology will reconsider!

Re: Synology Lost the Plot with Hard Drive Locking Move

#278

Post by Hamuko »

Zekio wrote: post #273
Hamuko wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've heard things about Unraid not being that performant due to the design of the disk array solution.

you can run ZFS without the Unraid disk array in unraid these days

Doesn't that get rid of one of the biggest benefit of Unraid where you can mix and match drives, just like in a Synology hybrid RAID?

Re: Synology Lost the Plot with Hard Drive Locking Move

#279

Post by [deleted] »

spease wrote: post #225
franga2000 wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a great argument for selling drives, not for locking your devices down to practically require them

> That's a great argument for selling drives, not for locking your devices down to practically require them The counterargument is, people won’t listen and then blame Synology when their data is affected. At which point it may be too late for anything but attempting data recovery. Sufficiently nontechnical users may blame the visible product (the NAS) even if the issue is some nuance to the parts choice made by a tec…

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