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South Korean president declares martial law, parliament votes to lift it

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Re: South Korean president declares martial law, parliament votes to lift it

#271

Post by myrmidon »

decremental wrote: post #8

This article reeks to high hell of the regime propaganda writing we see about domestic politics: "Yoon — whose approval rating has dipped in recent months — has struggled to push his agenda against an opposition-controlled parliament since taking office in 2022. Yoon’s conservative People Power Party had been locked in an impasse with the liberal opposition Democratic Party over next year’s budget bill. He has also b…

Do you think that "low approval" and "scandals involving his wife" are completely irrelevant here? Should those be omitted from an article like this because he is on the conservative side of the spectrum?

Re: South Korean president declares martial law, parliament votes to lift it

#272

Post by NalNezumi »

intoamplitudes wrote: post #11

Transparent coup d'etat attempt rumored to happen for months. The only option when the mouse is cornered. Approval rating in the <10% range, Japan whispering in his ear and pulling the puppet strings, crazy selfish wife abusing state resources, it is almost comically predictable if not for how serious it is. North Korea is always the convenient excuse... only hope Westerners don't get fooled by the rhetoric. Guy digg…

>Japan whispering in his ear and pulling the puppet strings

I'm curious if you have some sources for this? I'm not that familiar with SK politics and I'm obviously biased since almost all info about SK I either get from English/Japanese sources.

Afaik he was pretty dovish towards Japan during his election, which goes against the decades long tradition of tit-for-tat during election between SK&Japan since "looking tough to the neighbor" win votes. I wasn't aware of any "Japan whispering in his ear" level embezzlement. He seems just more pro US, closer ties with Japan rather than "balance things between China/US-JP"

Re: South Korean president declares martial law, parliament votes to lift it

#273

Post by jknoepfler »

Uvix wrote: post #185
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Is that really as true as it used to be since COVID? A number of governments enacted quite astonishingly repressive measures Zero countries in the West enacted anything resembling martial law. The only freedoms abridged were those of movement and assembly, and even then the penalty was being shut down or ticketed, rarely jail, never summary execution.

Saying it doesn't resemble martial law, and then immediately listing freedoms that were abolished, is a contradiction. Rather than "freedom of movement and assembly", I'd argue that what we lost was "freedom of due process". Everyone was jailed, just in their own homes.

No, I and everyone else was still able to leave our homes. We were free to assemble in large numbers outside. I (and many others) exercised free assembly rights to protest the murder of George Floyd, for example (not the riots... ironically the one example of somethimg resembling martial law being imposed, albeit belatedly and with great reluctance).

There was no curfew, particularly no curfew enforced by the military with threat of violence... ah, except during actual riots in a few cities.

Businesses were forced to close alongside many non-essential government services.

Nobody was jailed, not even in their own homes.

Enforcement was through ordinary civil means, not by actual soldiers pointing guns at you, unaccountable to civilian law.

Re: South Korean president declares martial law, parliament votes to lift it

#274

Post by cogman10 »

jandrese wrote: post #199
nurumaik wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is he going to ban voting next?

I think the next step is just to jail anybody who might vote against him.

IDK why you are grey right now because his statements reported by CNN are basically a purging of the opposition party.

The entire reason he declared martial law was to eliminate the opposition.

Re: South Korean president declares martial law, parliament votes to lift it

#275

Post by anon291 »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #266
anon291 wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> Arguing the difference between a turd sandwich and a shit sandwich It's arguing a rubber duck from a battleship. Emergency powers != martial law. Martial law in America would mean suspending the Constitution. Calling anything that happened in America during lockdown martial law is the equivalent of Karen calling bad service at a restaurant an assault on her rights. It's misunderstanding a term but wanting to use it…

> Who are these people you keep referring to?

Just the various takes i've read in newspapers about why people are fed up and desire change.

> Martial law in America would mean suspending the Constitution.

> Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof;

The SC has ruled that 'Congress' means the government writ large, including state governments.

https://www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2020-04-26/pastor...

https://www.npr.org/2021/02/06/964822479/supreme-court-rules...

Oops... guess that one was suspended! If you have to appeal to SCOTUS to un-suspend it, it's safe to say that it was suspended.

Re: South Korean president declares martial law, parliament votes to lift it

#277

Post by echoangle »

anon291 wrote: post #250
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> making people do that for 14 days after traveling anywhere in the country is martial law in all but name only It's not. If we broaden to this definition, America has been under martial law since passports, border control and driver's licenses. > imposing fines instead of jailing people for exercising civil rights is still martial law No, it isn't. If we broaden to this definition, America has been under martial law…

[flagged]

You’re just shifting goalposts. First it’s martial law, then it gets disproven and the response is „ok, but still bad!“. Why not make a correct claim in the first place?

Re: South Korean president declares martial law, parliament votes to lift it

#278

Post by kube-system »

vachina wrote: post #265
poszlem wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Help me understand why US should be world police.

Because the world has never been a more peaceful place than when the US was a major dominant superpower.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pax_Americana

Re: South Korean president declares martial law, parliament votes to lift it

#279

Post by mistrial9 »

potato3732842 wrote: post #53
bloomingkales wrote: post #32

Orwell being so right about governments using the constant threat of a virtual enemy has got to be one of the all time top on the money predictions ever. Up there with gravity and shit. I wish we could do something with this information, but alas, knowledge isnt power. Cersei Lannister: Power is power.

>Orwell being so right about governments using the constant threat of a virtual enemy has got to be one of the all time top on the money predictions ever. The way modern states leverage external threats to justify abusing people or waging their own external wars is fairly parallel to how the less top heavy kingdoms of the middle ages and early modern period used religion as a justification for comparable atrocities.

this topic is large and easily misunderstood. No absolute statement covers all. therefore all absolute statements are untrue. People originated as tribal groups, most of them fought violently over territory at times. Meanwhile "religion" is always present, but in varied forms. The stratification and codification of "religion" and The State occurred in different ways in different cultures, but it is certainly a compromise between active violence and active spiritual traditions, in a society. You can say "people who claim to be ReligionX used violence" and it means more than one thing.

Re: South Korean president declares martial law, parliament votes to lift it

#280

Post by JumpCrisscross »

anon291 wrote: post #275
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Arguing the difference between a turd sandwich and a shit sandwich It's arguing a rubber duck from a battleship. Emergency powers != martial law. Martial law in America would mean suspending the Constitution. Calling anything that happened in America during lockdown martial law is the equivalent of Karen calling bad service at a restaurant an assault on her rights. It's misunderstanding a term but wanting to use it…

> Who are these people you keep referring to? Just the various takes i've read in newspapers about why people are fed up and desire change. > Martial law in America would mean suspending the Constitution. > Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; The SC has ruled that 'Congress' means the government writ large, including state governments. https://…

> various takes i've read in newspapers about why people are fed up and desire change

They made less money. I'm looking forward to the next two years: I and everyone in my friend circle are going to make a lot of money. Even if we do nothing.

> if you have to appeal to SCOTUS to un-suspend it, it's safe to say that it was suspended

You're using a judiciary striking down an unconstitutional law as an example of martial law? Maybe start with the Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martial_law.

Here's a hint: if you can appeal to any court, you're not under martial law.

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