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Gnome Files: A detailed UI examination

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Re: Gnome Files: A detailed UI examination

#271

Post by hulitu »

kaba0 wrote: post #195
savolai wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This should help you trace the argumentation to cited research that is certainly not ”tone deaf”: https://www.nngroup.com/articles/ten-usability-heuristics/ 1. *Consistency and Standards* Claim: "The 'View Options' dropdown didn't contain view options, but rather sort options, and I didn't realize it was a split button with two completely different functions." Violation: This breaks Consistency and Standards. The use…

Something like this would have been a better post than the linked one, but even this is not necessarily objective on each count - and design has a fundamentally subjective, human element based on our collective experience with every kind of interface, ever, which is affected by experience/culture, everything. E.g. in your list: there is no “dropdown name”, it’s a misidentified element by the post writer. Add to it th…

> design has a fundamentally subjective, human element based on our collective experience

This "collective experience" seems to be missing for people "designing"'(an overstatement) such interfaces.

And talking about "experience": That's why they redesign it with every release ?

Re: Gnome Files: A detailed UI examination

#272

Post by hulitu »

lifthrasiir wrote: post #242
steakscience wrote: post #241

There are many valid critiques of GNOME but this isn't one of them. A split button is an accepted and widely used pattern.

A split button where a dropdown is not a superset of what is achievable by a button is, however, not common. It is a direct violation of user expectation.

But still a "widely used pattern".

Re: Gnome Files: A detailed UI examination

#273

Post by hulitu »

IshKebab wrote: post #75

I couldn't agree more. The Gnome devs have a very long track record of imposing universally hated UI/UX design on people. I'd wonder why KDE isn't more popular, but I'm pretty sure the main reason is that the Gnome devs also have way better aesthetic taste than the KDE devs. Gnome simply looks much nicer in screenshots. They understand spacing. That and KDE had it's own major UI/UX fuck up with Plasma.

> but I'm pretty sure the main reason is that the Gnome devs also have way better aesthetic taste than the KDE devs

Or, maybe, Gnome comes as default on more computers ?

Re: Gnome Files: A detailed UI examination

#274

Post by hulitu »

pxmpxm wrote: post #177
cetu86 wrote: post #55

I get it that gnome is nowadays an experimental desktop environment, that tries a lot of new approaches. I just don't understand why many distributions use it as their default DE.

I am fairly sure the people behind Gnome don't actually really know what they're doing when it comes to HID and Ux. Gnome terminal for example will offset the right click contextual menu with a new line of bin/hex/oct representation of a number that you happen to have selected. By default, no it can't be disabled. Good luck with the muscle memory to hit the contextual menu items now that everything is shifted down.

> I am fairly sure the people behind Gnome don't actually really know what they're doing when it comes to HID and Ux.

Someone who knows what he is doing does not start over every couple of years.

Re: Gnome Files: A detailed UI examination

#275

Post by giancarlostoro »

Having used Gnome for years, my favorite version was Gnome 3 in its early hated days, and a lot of what I liked disappeared. Gnome seems to be inconsistently changed. I would much prefer to just default to using MATE, though these days I use mostly KDE because the UI is consistent across its many apps.

Re: Gnome Files: A detailed UI examination

#276

Post by prmoustache »

account42 wrote: post #251
prmoustache wrote: post #247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfair. Format is followed by ... which implies it opens a dialog. That dialog starts a 2 steps process, the last one being a warning in red telling you it will destroy every data permanently. There is no way you can accidentally format a device. Also, people who want a quick way to poweroff can change the behavior of the power button to ... poweroff instead of suspend.

Users are generally used to closing dialogs without fully reading them, especially dialogs they did not expect because they wanted to eject the drive because they want to leave now and are already running late.

I don't think anyone would hit next then that red format button instead of the cancel button by mistake and if she does that person really deserve her data to be destroyed.

Re: Gnome Files: A detailed UI examination

#277

Post by mixmastamyk »

yoavm wrote: post #267
mixmastamyk wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes—we can see it's a suboptimal design on its face.[1] Bunch of repetitive dots and lines, with misleading clues. Not everyone is going to respond to it the same way of course. Some folks don't bother with clues. The main point is that this problem has been solved already, better and in the past, by products delivered to tens of millions of seats. Merely copying prior art would have sufficed. Responding with, "I fou…

That's a very long and quite condescending way to say you actually didn't ask anyone.

Already been studied at length. There are citations at that link and more a search away.

Tone-policing makes for a boring discussion as well.

Re: Gnome Files: A detailed UI examination

#278

Post by wao0uuno »

consteval wrote: post #260
wao0uuno wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only KDE and Gnome offer proper Wayland support making them in my eyes the only truly modern DEs on your list. Out of these two, Gnome is the only one that doesn’t glitch constantly. It’s true that Plasma finally stopped krashing every time you look at it funny but it’s still a bloated, glitchy mess of a DE. You really can’t count on KDE to provide updates without introducing major bugs and stability issues as proven…

I don't think this is true, I haven't gotten plasma crashes for a long time now. Even early into Plasma 5 it was stable. Also bloat is so very debatable. You can't on one hand complain about Gnome being unusable and then turn around and say Plasma is bloated. Uh, that "bloat" is the difference between the two!

The difference between the two is that Gnome is at least trying to constantly deliver stable and high quality desktop experience. I don’t like the way Gnome works, I don’t like the way their organization is run but I like when my computer just works. I don’t have time to fuck around with buggy Plasma widgets. I was a Plasma 5 users for two years until 2022 and I still use it on my Steam Deck occasionally. My opinion is based on experience.

Re: Gnome Files: A detailed UI examination

#279

Post by consteval »

wao0uuno wrote: post #278
consteval wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this is true, I haven't gotten plasma crashes for a long time now. Even early into Plasma 5 it was stable. Also bloat is so very debatable. You can't on one hand complain about Gnome being unusable and then turn around and say Plasma is bloated. Uh, that "bloat" is the difference between the two!

The difference between the two is that Gnome is at least trying to constantly deliver stable and high quality desktop experience. I don’t like the way Gnome works, I don’t like the way their organization is run but I like when my computer just works. I don’t have time to fuck around with buggy Plasma widgets. I was a Plasma 5 users for two years until 2022 and I still use it on my Steam Deck occasionally. My opinion…

I've never had a gnome extension not break between releases. They're basically plasma widgets, except not even made by the gnome devs. Terrific...

Re: Gnome Files: A detailed UI examination

#280

Post by kabushawarib »

Hello, Files developer here, just posting my personal thoughts, opinions and anecdotes. Not speaking on behalf of any other GNOME contributor:

Seems hacker news don't allow long comments, so I will put it in an external link: https://pastebin.com/bqjqbVqs

TL;DR I agree with some opinions, I disagree with others. Few of the complaints were either very recently rectified, or seems to be just bugs because I can't reproduce or understand them.

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