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The Cheapest NAS

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Re: The Cheapest NAS

#271

My secret protip: old Fujitsu desktop/nuc PCs. At least in Germany (Europe?) they are cheap on ebay since a lot of businesses use them and upgrade on a regular schedule. If you care about power consumption like I do, you can Google "$model energy consumption white paper" which contains very accurate data about idle usage, for example https://sp.ts.fujitsu.com/dmsp/Publications/public/wp-energy... In one case I had a…

I'm looking for a machine like this (affordable, small, low power usage) with 64GB memory. If anyone has any recommendations I'm all ears.

The cheapest computers with Alder Lake N CPUs, like ODROID H4 and many others, have only a single SODIMM socket and they are limited to 48 GB (which works, despite Ark advertising a limit of only 16 GB).

However there are many NUC-like small computers made by various Chinese companies, with AMD Ryzen CPUs and with 2 SODIMM sockets, in which you can use 64 GB of DRAM.

Those using older Ryzen models, like the 5000 series, may be found at prices between $220 and $350. Those using newer Ryzen models, up to Zen 4 based 7000 or 8000 series, are more expensive, i.e. between $400 and $600.

While there are dozens of very cheap computer models made by Chinese firms, the similar models made by ASUS or the like are significantly more expensive. After the Intel NUC line has been bought by ASUS, they have raised its prices a lot.

Even so, if a non-Chinese computer is desired and 64 GB is the only requirement, then Intel NUCs from older generations like NUC 13 or NUC 12, with Core i3 CPUs, can still be found at prices between $350 and $400 (the traditional prices of barebone Intel NUCs were $350 for Core i3, $500 for Core i5 and $650 for Core i7, but they have been raised a lot for the latest models).

EDIT: Looking now at Newegg, I see various variants of ASUS NUC 14 Pro with the Intel Core 3 100U CPU, which are under $400 (barebone).

It should be noted that this CPU is a Raptor Lake Refresh and not a Meteor Lake CPU, like in the more expensive models of NUC 14 Pro.

This is a small computer designed to work reliably for many years on a 24/7 schedule, so if reliability would be important, especially when using it as a server, I would choose this. It supports up to 96 GB of DRAM (with two 48 GB SODIMMs). If performance per dollar would be more important, then there are cheaper and faster computers with Ryzen CPUs, made by Chinese companies like Minisforum or Beelink.

Re: The Cheapest NAS

#272
post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A NAS is not magical. It is just a rather limited computer. Anything a NAS can do so can a normal desktop, and it'll do it better. Sharing files over a network is one of these things. Managing the files is way, way, better since you just use your normal desktop file manager rather than some NAS web stuff that'll break due to CA TLS issues in a few years.

Desktop computers are becoming increasingly uncommon. I'm a pretty technologically inclined person and I havent owned a desktop in years. For most people, laptops have been more than capable enough for their needs for a long time. And for general purpose computing, smartphones are pretty heavily used too.

Yes, people do think that. And then they end up with an octopus of fragile external drives prone to problems and breakage. It's a sad state of affairs for the non-tech inclined. Like everyone is buying mopeds and pulling around trailers rather than just buying a small car.

Re: The Cheapest NAS

#273
post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's OK for corporate systems, but complete overkill for personal setups. My personal files are ultimately a lot more important to me and much more irreplaceable than any files at work. I'd never run a NAS without ZFS and ECC.

The "personal files" I really want to keep safe amount to around 500MB of truly important data (pdfs, scanned documents, text files etc) and ~200GB of images and videos. Both of which are 3-2-1 backed up. Adding an ECC motherboard to my NAS would cost more than a quarter century of cloud storage for that amount of data. The rest of my terabytes of data would be inconvenient to lose, but not fatal. In the worst case I…

> Both of which are 3-2-1 backed up.

Keep in mind that backups are a solution to a different problem than ECC.

If a file is silently corrupted you could be backing up the corrupt file for years and by the time you discover the problem, it has spread to every available backup.

Re: The Cheapest NAS

#274
post #25

The image builder for this board looks dodgy af: "The distribution builder is a proprietary commercial offering as it involves a lot of customer IP and integrations so it cannot be public." Seems like a supply side injector to me!

Yeah, reading through the linked https://hub.libre.computer/t/source-code-git-repository-for-... really sours my opinion of Libre Computer - shipping with UEFI so you can just use generic images is a huge advantage, but creating your default images (and firmware! which is worse, IMO) with a proprietary process is such a big red flag that it makes me question the whole thing. If the firmware is FOSS and you can build…

Too bad TALOS II is a $5K motherboard. It actually is open down to the brass firmware tacks!

Re: The Cheapest NAS

#275

My secret protip: old Fujitsu desktop/nuc PCs. At least in Germany (Europe?) they are cheap on ebay since a lot of businesses use them and upgrade on a regular schedule. If you care about power consumption like I do, you can Google "$model energy consumption white paper" which contains very accurate data about idle usage, for example https://sp.ts.fujitsu.com/dmsp/Publications/public/wp-energy... In one case I had a…

[dead]

Re: The Cheapest NAS

#276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can buy a DAS (Direct Attached Storage) enclosure[1], some even support RAID. If your Nuc is multipurpose, you could then run a virtualized TrueNAS guest (BSD or linux) in QEMU and give it control of the DAS block device for ZFS pools. Being able to run a virtual NAS that actually gets security updates on demand is pretty neat - TrueNAS has an excellent API you can use to start/stop services (SMB, SSH, iSCSI, etc…

Isn't running a NAS on top of USB storage very strongly discouraged? TrueNAS cautions against it. I also want to set up a NAS on a mini-PC with some sort of attached external storage, but I haven't been able to get past this blocker. USB is the only external interface these mini PCs typically support.

There are issues with USB from a compatibility standpoint. I think its mainly a factor of the ubiquity of it, there are SO many poor controller chips out there, even when you buy seemingly reputable hubs/drive cases. Its hard to find a good one sometimes. I did, however, stumble upon a gem early on, it was a 3.5" usb drive case from BestBuy which has since been discontinued(because it was good). Never in 15 years has any of the half dozen ones i got dropped from thier system. This is more than i could say about alot of pricey stuff on amazon sadly. Its typically manifested as a random loss in connectivity to the system.

Similarly, heres a very low power writeup I did for using 2.5" drives with a dedicated power hub/splitter. http://www.jofla.net/?p=00000106#00000106 This will still have issues if the mains lines sag (a pole goes down somewhere), but you can fix it with a reboot remotely. Other than that it works great.

This was/is definitely a labor of love, primarily as I've come from a time when all you could get for a server were huge boxes idling at 50 watts, so i felt guilty of all the power I used to consume.

Re: The Cheapest NAS

#278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cloud storage isn't a backup any more than RAID 1 is.

Of course it is. PC explodes -> download the cloud copy. Not to be relied on by itself, but it absolutely qualifies as a backup.

Backup solutions usually need to cover more scenarios than "PC explodes". In fact solutions for that are usually called "disaster recovery" instead.

A real backup solution ought to cover the case where you deleted the wrong file, and you find out the next day. Or it got corrupted somehow (PCs and disks can explode slowly) and you find out the next time you open it, a week later. If the cloud service happily replicated that change, it can't be used to restore anything.

Re: The Cheapest NAS

#279
post #25

The image builder for this board looks dodgy af: "The distribution builder is a proprietary commercial offering as it involves a lot of customer IP and integrations so it cannot be public." Seems like a supply side injector to me!

Yet another reason to avoid the cargo-culting that is "NAS" for home use cases. Just put the disks in your computers.
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