Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

We are all animals at night

hazlitt.net

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

271–280 of 295 posts

Re: We are all animals at night

#271

Post by matt-attack »

ianai wrote: post #28

This is very well written and gripping even. I don’t see the negatives other commenters are pointing out. Yes she’s talking about her perceptions born from her clients and years worked. That’s an absolute right for all of us, right? To simply relate the experiences we’ve had. She’s definitely seen a side of humanity that, while seen by many, doesn’t quite often get public visibility-sunlight. And lo and behold, it’s…

It’s funny you never see eloquent, well written articles about dishwashers who live in sweaty kitchens of dive Chinese restaurants, existing on the edge of society, jammed into studio apartments in the worst parts of town, just eking by.

You never read accounts of backbreaking laborers who dig ditches day in day out, or service sewer systems, covered in refuse. They sacrifice their bodies for their paycheck, and too live on the edge of society. We’re taught that laborers sacrificing their bodies in this manner is just par for the course.

The massage worker’s account almost seems white collar in comparison.

Re: We are all animals at night

#272

Post by stickfigure »

vacuity wrote: post #230
throwaway22044 wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Offering some amount of consentual self-destruction is absolutely in the business of helping mankind, Prostitution, substance abuse, suicide, and other self-destructive acts, are the only measure that is available to us for enforcing that Leviathan keeps its end of the social contract: that our bodies and minds are first and foremost our own, and only when we infringe on others' freedom may ours be curtailed. The da…

Suicide is an expression of one's ultimate freedom to one's body, but these acts can have consequences beyond oneself. That goes from "oh well, it's your choice" to "don't drag other people down with you". What of a child born from a prostitute? What of others' safety when driving drunk? What of friends and family who expend mental energy and money? Cut yourself away absolutely or not at all, or perhaps in a more mea…

> What of a child born from a prostitute?

That's an interesting statement. Do you think that sex workers should not be allowed to have children? Any other noteworthy groups in your eugenics policy?

Re: We are all animals at night

#273

Post by stickfigure »

imtringued wrote: post #236
ianai wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s all accurate and inaccurate because people are all very different and come to different positions differently. Some believe they can “sin” under the cover of night and still keep their comfortable places in society as their sins weren’t seen nor known. Secrets and all that. Imagine how such a person would treat a sex worker. Could be very starkly different than what they’d expose the rest of the time. You’ll not…

She only has experience with customers who seek her out though. What about the type of men who would never ask for her services? She knows nothing about them.

You think the author has never had normal relationships with men? Why would you assume that?

Re: We are all animals at night

#274

Post by doublerabbit »

doublerabbit wrote: post #247
ianai wrote: post #28

This is very well written and gripping even. I don’t see the negatives other commenters are pointing out. Yes she’s talking about her perceptions born from her clients and years worked. That’s an absolute right for all of us, right? To simply relate the experiences we’ve had. She’s definitely seen a side of humanity that, while seen by many, doesn’t quite often get public visibility-sunlight. And lo and behold, it’s…

> May this serve as a good reminder to treat all people with decency and an amount of respect if not kindness. There’s exactly one right way to treat a person, as a person-an end unto his/it/herself. And in the scenario where that if you have a neighbor who decides to have his apartment windows open and TV on loud till 3am? I've tried speaking to him, wrote him a letter, yet he's ignored all. I'm now looking in to ta…

Downvoters: Why should I give respect to my neighbour?

Why should someone who takes a child life as an pedophile, deserve respect niceness?

Why should someone who's a psychopath who goes their own way to murder deserve respect?

Why should someone who carries out unspeakable crimes, be respected?

Your telling me that no one can answer those questions?

Re: We are all animals at night

#275

Post by yieldcrv »

zapataband1 wrote: post #200
whimsicalism wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did not read it that way and I think that she would have phrased it differently if so. “an industry where women get to call the shots” she would have said “would get” imo if your interpretation was correct, just as you use ‘would’ in your comment. I took her to be describing sex work in the present, not some hypothetical future sex work. Here is the excerpt for those who want to judge for themselves: ‘Unlike sex wo…

Women can call more of the shots in places where it is legal like Nevada or other countries. Not saying it's a perfect system but the alterntive so far has been a trade that is controlled by criminals, bad customers, and law enforcement.

That’s not often true in sex work relying on a venue, and certainly not nevada, and the few women run organizations have the same power dynamics and labor problems as all the others

Should really include sex workers in these discussions

All this conjecture that its exclusively a male run coercive trait exacerbating anything

Re: We are all animals at night

#276

Post by yieldcrv »

nuancebydefault wrote: post #46
ACow_Adonis wrote: post #40

I feel like I'm missing some cultural context here that made this a semi- difficult read: obviously? the word "massage parlour" is some local euphemism for some kind of sex work and its implied they aren't actually masseurs/masseuses? but can someone explain to me exactly what the nature of the arrangement/work/ business she's working in is? is it just prostitution and for some reason they don't call it that in Canad…

I struggled with that aspect as well, but after reading the piece entirely, it becomes clear that massage parlour is used as an euphemism. Also about being legal or not, it's probably work in the lite-grey zone (it's not Texas after all). The schedule looks something like, during a fixed period of time at night you just wait until you get scheduled/picked. That said, I don't think it is very important for the article…

I felt it was because just as soon as I realized she was talking about a rub and tug where she gives handjobs instead of massages, she then mentions a mutual shower that I have no idea what she’s talking about. Are they both naked in the shower and nothing happens? Are these massage parlors in Finch Alley awesome? Does all of Canada specify “parlor” to mean $80 late night showers with prostitutes as distinctive from spas where people might have a license?

This always happens to me when I read editorials from Commonwealth countries, the euphemisms are so deep and ingrained that I have no idea what they’re talking about.

I could empathize better with more context.

“I rubbed massage oil on a man’s chest at 1am and I was tired” that’s an entirely different article

Re: We are all animals at night

#277

Post by QuercusMax »

scns wrote: post #226
raincole wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have men been told they're entitled to sex and attention for free tho? I kinda feel it's the exact opposite. Men are told they need to pay for meals, rooms, travel, and housing and custody later. Men are told they should be the proactive side and take the risk of being rejected. I'd even say (at least in TV shows and movies) men are expected to be the funny ones and provide entertaining values in a relationship. I'm…

> Men are told they should be the proactive side and take the risk of being rejected. Walking up to a woman takes courage, which is a desirable quality. Why should a woman wan't a man, that lacks the balls to talk to her? The mating dance of many species has rules they have to follow. Complaining about them does zero for your dating success. The female decides if his display is good enough for her. The App Bumble has…

That might work for some relationships, but not all. My wife made the first move, and technically I think she actually proposed first - but these gender roles are by no means hard coded and are primarily enforced through social structures.

Different strokes for different folks. Don't be so strict with your social structures and you'll probably be happier.

Re: We are all animals at night

#278

Post by tasuki »

stickfigure wrote: post #272
vacuity wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Suicide is an expression of one's ultimate freedom to one's body, but these acts can have consequences beyond oneself. That goes from "oh well, it's your choice" to "don't drag other people down with you". What of a child born from a prostitute? What of others' safety when driving drunk? What of friends and family who expend mental energy and money? Cut yourself away absolutely or not at all, or perhaps in a more mea…

> What of a child born from a prostitute? That's an interesting statement. Do you think that sex workers should not be allowed to have children? Any other noteworthy groups in your eugenics policy?

It was a question, not a statement. And your ended with a loaded question. Not cool.

Re: We are all animals at night

#279

Post by AlecSchueler »

SpriglyElixir12 wrote: post #37
AlecSchueler wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At the same time it might feed into the objectification of women which will actively harm the needs of half the population.

Is this implying that male versions won't exist?

Objectification of men is a far less alarming issue in our patriarchal society.

Re: We are all animals at night

#280

Post by tasuki »

memefrog wrote: post #243
acc_297 wrote: post #57

I worked long months in the forestry industry (re-planting trees) during university it’s not so tough as sex work but sometimes people throw it in the bag of “low-skill” or “manual labour” jobs as if thought or critical thinking we’re not required. I have to say now working a “real” job now (for salary benefits etc.) I know way more forestry folks who could do my job today (consulting) than current coworkers who coul…

There is such a thing as low-skill labour. Nobody said 'no skill required'. The term is low-skill. Of the people I have met that do manual labouring jobs, I know many people could do those jobs if they got fit and learnt to do them, and that those people could not learn to do intellectual work no matter how hard they tried. Also working in the forestry industry is much harder than having sex for a living.

> Also working in the forestry industry is much harder than having sex for a living.

Have you done both?

Post reply on HN