I wish GPT4 had never happened • Hacker News Board

Re: I wish GPT4 had never happened

#271

Post by qgin » Sat, Apr 08, 2023, 3:18 PM UTC

netbioserror wrote: post #86

Aaargh20318 wrote: post #29

The big oversight here is that Priya does not want a job , what Priya wants is an income . The point of life is not working, the point of life is to enjoy it. We should strive to eliminate as many jobs as we possibly can, the less we have to work the better it is. To make this possible we need to find a way to a new system that doesn't directly link labour with income .

What a profoundly naive opinion. Most people find meaning, fulfillment, even contentment in working, especially when the problems are engaging and the solutions produce value. Many people claim their lives would be better if they never had to work, but they are bullshitting themselves with childhood naivete. Not working is a sucking void of boredom, nihilism, hedonism, and despair. I've been through some of that befo…

> We need something valuable to do and most are incapable of summoning valuable ideas and tasks from the ether.

If quitting a job leaves you with no apparent valuable work to do in your life, that's probably a sign of being only engaged with the world through your job. There are never-ending lists of useful things to for family, for friends, for groups/organizations/churches you're part of, for the neighborhood you live in... and that's before even thinking about personal projects that are useful to yourself.

Sorry, I really bristled at this comment. People who are engaged in the world and have accepted responsibility in areas that aren't solely their job don't have to summon valuable ideas and tasks from the ether. You won't find the bottom of the to-do list. Not bullshitting.

Re: I wish GPT4 had never happened

#272

Post by stickfigure » Sat, Apr 08, 2023, 3:18 PM UTC

inimino wrote: post #169

logicalmonster wrote: post #138

1) Chaudry's article is amazing in its lack of creative thinking. If people like Priya can be ~10 times more productive wielding some AI tools, that means that many companies can potentially produce 10 times as many products/services and make more things that will enrich peoples' lives. Though some people in some companies might be laid off, it doesn't necessarily mean that more people will be laid off than new jobs…

Your comment is amazing in its naivete. The first sentence in the post you are replying to already includes awareness of everything you said and more, while nothing in your comment suggests you understood the post at all. Priya doesn't become 10 times more productive, someone else uses the tool to do her job, which no longer exists.

Priya has a university degree in biotechnology. If that doesn't qualify her for something more productive than GPT-level work, there's something fundamentally wrong with the educational system.

She's in her 20s, educated, and lives in a country that, for all its problems, is on a strong growth trend. She's not a 60yo UAW worker in Detroit.

Re: I wish GPT4 had never happened

#273

Post by lmarcos » Sat, Apr 08, 2023, 3:18 PM UTC

netbioserror wrote: post #86

Aaargh20318 wrote: post #29

The big oversight here is that Priya does not want a job , what Priya wants is an income . The point of life is not working, the point of life is to enjoy it. We should strive to eliminate as many jobs as we possibly can, the less we have to work the better it is. To make this possible we need to find a way to a new system that doesn't directly link labour with income .

What a profoundly naive opinion. Most people find meaning, fulfillment, even contentment in working, especially when the problems are engaging and the solutions produce value. Many people claim their lives would be better if they never had to work, but they are bullshitting themselves with childhood naivete. Not working is a sucking void of boredom, nihilism, hedonism, and despair. I've been through some of that befo…

OP means work as in "working for a company", not as in "doing something besides sitting on the couch".

Re: I wish GPT4 had never happened

#274

Post by xedrac » Sat, Apr 08, 2023, 3:19 PM UTC

whiddershins wrote: post #246

felipemnoa wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>This has been the promise over and over again, for centuries, and it has consistently not paid off. Where's the predicted society where automation allows us all to work for two hours a day, and spend the rest at leisure? I personally would hate to spend all my time on leisure activities. I would still be working as hard but on my passion projects. No offense but who wants to spend most of their time on leisure acti…

I second this. Leisure is not all it is cracked up to be.

No, but having a good balance of leisure and work makes both of them better.

Re: I wish GPT4 had never happened

#275

Post by sigstoat » Sat, Apr 08, 2023, 3:19 PM UTC

pavel_lishin wrote: post #167

logicalmonster wrote: post #138

1) Chaudry's article is amazing in its lack of creative thinking. If people like Priya can be ~10 times more productive wielding some AI tools, that means that many companies can potentially produce 10 times as many products/services and make more things that will enrich peoples' lives. Though some people in some companies might be laid off, it doesn't necessarily mean that more people will be laid off than new jobs…

> that means that many companies can potentially produce 10 times as many products/services and make more things that will enrich peoples' lives. This has been the promise over and over again, for centuries, and it has consistently not paid off. Where's the predicted society where automation allows us all to work for two hours a day, and spend the rest at leisure? > Though some people in some companies might be laid…

> Where's the predicted society where automation allows us all to work for two hours a day, and spend the rest at leisure?

if you'd like the standard of living of a few centuries ago, you can probably fund that by programming for a couple hours a week. instead you want entertainments, medicines and foods that take correspondingly more effort to produce.

Re: I wish GPT4 had never happened

#276

Post by gardenhedge » Sat, Apr 08, 2023, 3:19 PM UTC

netbioserror wrote: post #86

Aaargh20318 wrote: post #29

The big oversight here is that Priya does not want a job , what Priya wants is an income . The point of life is not working, the point of life is to enjoy it. We should strive to eliminate as many jobs as we possibly can, the less we have to work the better it is. To make this possible we need to find a way to a new system that doesn't directly link labour with income .

What a profoundly naive opinion. Most people find meaning, fulfillment, even contentment in working, especially when the problems are engaging and the solutions produce value. Many people claim their lives would be better if they never had to work, but they are bullshitting themselves with childhood naivete. Not working is a sucking void of boredom, nihilism, hedonism, and despair. I've been through some of that befo…

Extrapolating your experience to all of humanity is not useful.

Re: I wish GPT4 had never happened

#277

Post by wpietri » Sat, Apr 08, 2023, 3:19 PM UTC

iampims wrote: post #245

wpietri wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What a profoundly naive opinion. Most people find meaning, fulfillment, even contentment in working [...] Agreed. I just spent a week volunteering. (At the Pinball Hall of Fame in Las Vegas, repairing machines.) It actually cost me money to do, but it was incredibly satisfying to just go and do a concrete thing that made the world better and was immediately beneficial to people. Especially in the company of other g…

You did work and enjoyed it without it being your job. Maybe that’s the difference?

No. I also like jobs. I like them better, as they're cash-positive. I haven't liked all my jobs, but that's because some of them were terrible or bullshit.

Re: I wish GPT4 had never happened

#278

Post by chii » Sat, Apr 08, 2023, 3:19 PM UTC

bryanlarsen wrote: post #181

jzb wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That would be great. It’s also not going to happen without a massive uprising. The people profiting off automation have zero intent of sharing the wealth and every intent of hoarding it.

To over-simplify, revolutions happen when young men get bored, gather into mobs to entertain themselves, and then somebody with a cause directs that mob into action. The standard way to prevent revolutions is to channel the energy of young men into a productive job and a family. But today, bored young men entertain themselves with video games etc rather than gathering in mobs to entertain themselves. We don't have la…

tell that to the french gov't right now!

Re: I wish GPT4 had never happened

#279

Post by yashap » Sat, Apr 08, 2023, 3:19 PM UTC

Job loss is one thing, but in all honesty, my main concern with AI is that it’ll wipe out humanity.

My thoughts:

- If we ever achieve an AGI with legitimate consciousness/self-awareness/agency, I believe it will be dramatically more powerful than humans

- Humans have driven countless numbers of species extinct, not because we’re trying to, but because we’re so much more powerful than them that we wipe them out by accident. They’re ants to us, we just don’t notice much about them, and IMO we’ll be ants to an AGI with legit consciousness/self-awareness/agency

- Obviously GPT4 is not that, but progress in AI has been so rapid recently that I believe we’ll get there in the relatively near future. Maybe 10 years, maybe 100, but it feels pretty likely it’s going to happen. When it does, I think humanity will be in an extremely tenuous position

Re: I wish GPT4 had never happened

#280

Post by photochemsyn » Sat, Apr 08, 2023, 3:20 PM UTC

pavel_lishin wrote: post #167

logicalmonster wrote: post #138

1) Chaudry's article is amazing in its lack of creative thinking. If people like Priya can be ~10 times more productive wielding some AI tools, that means that many companies can potentially produce 10 times as many products/services and make more things that will enrich peoples' lives. Though some people in some companies might be laid off, it doesn't necessarily mean that more people will be laid off than new jobs…

> that means that many companies can potentially produce 10 times as many products/services and make more things that will enrich peoples' lives. This has been the promise over and over again, for centuries, and it has consistently not paid off. Where's the predicted society where automation allows us all to work for two hours a day, and spend the rest at leisure? > Though some people in some companies might be laid…

Why not use AI to automate away the board of directors and the shareholders?

It should be entirely possible. We just need an AI capable of generating its own capital, then the investor class can be removed from the loop.