Earlier quoted context omitted.
GP is talking about Mathis Milton. You're quoting a wikipedia article about Quintin Jones. Obviously, they are not the same person.
Whoops my mistake. I’ll try to make my point with Mathis Milton as well: “Milton dropped out of school after the 8th grade and worked as a cook, mechanic’s helper, and laborer before his arrest. Milton abused alcohol and drugs as a teenager.” In another article he was being referred to as having “low IQ”. Combined with the fact that the murders happened in a crack house, I infer that he probably lived in a similar en…
Texas Records All Inmates Last Words Before Execution And Puts Them All Online
271–280 of 300 posts
Re: Texas Records All Inmates Last Words Before Execution And Puts Them All Online
#272Those were... exceedingly difficult to read in some instances. Lots of prayers to god, family, and friends, and family and friends of the perpetrator's victim(s). But also some really resounding words about the state of justice in our country, and hearing them from some inmates who were in their mid-twenties no less.
The last words or the descriptions of the murders?
Re: Texas Records All Inmates Last Words Before Execution And Puts Them All Online
#273Earlier quoted context omitted.
Whoops my mistake. I’ll try to make my point with Mathis Milton as well: “Milton dropped out of school after the 8th grade and worked as a cook, mechanic’s helper, and laborer before his arrest. Milton abused alcohol and drugs as a teenager.” In another article he was being referred to as having “low IQ”. Combined with the fact that the murders happened in a crack house, I infer that he probably lived in a similar en…
What does that have to do with the killer not taking any responsibility, accusing other people of lacking humanity and saying to a victim that she was just "at the wrong place at the wrong time" with 0 other admission of guilt? I get that we could maybe, maybe stretch the argument that he had a rough upbringing (though dropping out of school isn't that extreme) to "explain" the circumstances of the crime... but not t…
With regards to the guilt question: I did make the honest mistake of misquoting the history of another inmate before, what stands out to me and what I wanted to point out: I don’t think it is a coincidence that both of those inmates grew up in an environment of poverty. We do have the specifics of what happened in childhood in the first case, the second one I can only infer from the fact of teenage drug use and of growing up in a certain environment, which are both things I would expect to have a high correlation with childhood trauma.
This is not to say that Milton is not guilty of a crime, in the legal sense. But to expect someone who has been beaten, abused and has gotten the short end of the stick all their life to take full individual responsibility for something he didn’t have a choice in does seem inhumane to me. In a way like Melanie, he was at the wrong place at the wrong time.
And what purpose would such an admission of guilt serve? Would it take make it easier to believe that tragedies like this are fully the individuals responsibility and that the environment the individual grows up in has no influence on the outcomes?
Re: Texas Records All Inmates Last Words Before Execution And Puts Them All Online
#274Earlier quoted context omitted.
There’s a kind of thing that happens in these discussions where somebody makes a complaint about an extremist position and somebody else responds that nobody thinks that and the two are kind of talking past one another. To be clear, I acknowledge that we’re talking about an extreme, broadly unpopular position, but it is one running through certain segments of leftish twitter and academia. (No, I don’t keep a file of…
>To be clear, I acknowledge that we’re talking about an extreme, broadly unpopular position, but it is one running through certain segments of leftish twitter and academia. (No, I don’t keep a file of such utterances, so I can’t produce a list offhand.) That's as may be, but lots of people say lots of stupid/ridiculous/untrue things all the time. Who, in a position of power or influence (or reasonably adjacent to suc…
I think the source of the conflict here is that, no, this does not follow. The position I described is distinctly progressive in nature, on the opposite end of the spectrum from a belief that one might characterize as conservative. That does not imply that everybody who identifies as progressive believes it.
Re: Texas Records All Inmates Last Words Before Execution And Puts Them All Online
#275Earlier quoted context omitted.
From Wikipedia: Jones experienced 'brutal conditions' during his childhood, suffering neglect by his parents, sexual assault by his siblings, and extreme poverty.[7][4][8] His mother threatened him with a gun, and when he was seven years old his older siblings forced him to have sex with his stepsister.[8] He shot himself twice, once in the hand to placate gang members and later in the chest in a suicide attempt. He…
There’s something very odd to me about the modern progressive position that, more or less, if you can explain a crime, then you can in some sense excuse it. That description of his childhood works for me in sociological terms — let’s avoid stuff that we know to create monsters — but not on individual ones (i.e. the monster, having been created, is indeed a monster).
Re: Texas Records All Inmates Last Words Before Execution And Puts Them All Online
#276Earlier quoted context omitted.
>To be clear, I acknowledge that we’re talking about an extreme, broadly unpopular position, but it is one running through certain segments of leftish twitter and academia. (No, I don’t keep a file of such utterances, so I can’t produce a list offhand.) That's as may be, but lots of people say lots of stupid/ridiculous/untrue things all the time. Who, in a position of power or influence (or reasonably adjacent to suc…
> * Does that mean that everyone who supports that political party (or even a a tiny fraction) also believes such things? By your logic, the answer should be "yes." Is that correct?* I think the source of the conflict here is that, no, this does not follow. The position I described is distinctly progressive in nature, on the opposite end of the spectrum from a belief that one might characterize as conservative. That…
No. The source of the "conflict," as you describe (I call it a spirited conversation, but whatever blows your skirt up) is that you made an unsupported assertion (that the "progressive" position is that people with bad childhoods shouldn't be prosecuted for crimes they go on to commit), and I asked for specific information as to who, exactly, claims that to be not only their position, but that of progressives in general.
You danced around that very specific request and then somewhat backed off your (ridiculous) assertion.
And no, you didn't say "it's a progressive position," you said[0]:
There’s something very odd to me about the modern
progressive position that, more or less, if you can
explain a crime, then you can in some sense excuse
it.
Not "a progressive postion," which is debatable at best, you called it "the progressive position" implying that was the belief of most who call themselves "progressive."That's simply not true. Nor has it ever been.
And I called you out on your wholly unsupported, unsubstantiated and flat wrong assertion.
You are seemingly trying to walk back your statement and chalk it up to "conflict."
No. I'm not in conflict with you at all. You may think you're in conflict with me, but I'm just here trying to have good faith discussions.
You might try it some time.
[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34317453
Edit: clarified my prose.
Re: Texas Records All Inmates Last Words Before Execution And Puts Them All Online
#277Earlier quoted context omitted.
Don’t you feel anything reading through these? It doesn’t remind you of the humanity of these people?
The question still stands. Why does the state bother to record them? What purpose does it serve for the pro capital punishment government to humanize those it executes?
Re: Texas Records All Inmates Last Words Before Execution And Puts Them All Online
#278Earlier quoted context omitted.
That doesn't sound like someone particularly mentally ill. Just your common dark triad who can't take responsibility for his actions.
That doesn't explain why you would write your final words to the person imprisoning you rather than the supposed family and friends mentioned in the last words. Why not more than one letter, if you have family AND friends. Seems to me like the warden is the only significant real person in their life and they lack the ability to distinguish relationships. I'm not a psychologist so just an observation.
Re: Texas Records All Inmates Last Words Before Execution And Puts Them All Online
#279Earlier quoted context omitted.
From Wikipedia: Jones experienced 'brutal conditions' during his childhood, suffering neglect by his parents, sexual assault by his siblings, and extreme poverty.[7][4][8] His mother threatened him with a gun, and when he was seven years old his older siblings forced him to have sex with his stepsister.[8] He shot himself twice, once in the hand to placate gang members and later in the chest in a suicide attempt. He…
There’s something very odd to me about the modern progressive position that, more or less, if you can explain a crime, then you can in some sense excuse it. That description of his childhood works for me in sociological terms — let’s avoid stuff that we know to create monsters — but not on individual ones (i.e. the monster, having been created, is indeed a monster).
Can you elaborate on this
Re: Texas Records All Inmates Last Words Before Execution And Puts Them All Online
#280Earlier quoted context omitted.
I read something like this and am reminded that many people in prison for violent crime are sociopaths or psychopaths. I'm not saying there aren't exceptions or even innocent convicts. It's just not the norm. Hard to take anything these guys say at face value.
The comments he made about the medical examiner's office aren't exactly empty comments. It wasn't hard to find this information, so consider googling before being so dismissive with comments like yours. The FBI ended up raiding the medical examiner's office in 2019: https://www.newschannel10.com/2019/09/24/texas-rangers-fbi-u... Whistleblower lawsuit: https://www.kcbd.com/story/29837207/lubbock-county-medical-e... “W…
But it's also the case that many people in that position are habitual liars. One can quibble over the reasons but it's just something that has to be taken into account. I'm reminded of that fact when I read something that seems to be pretty straightforward. A sane person would think sincerity especially likely in one's considered final words. An experienced person would laugh at such an absurdity.
HN is a funny place. For such a smart pool of commenters in other respects, people here tend not to be very attentive or psychologically nuanced readers. I'm often surprised how quickly y'all resort to scolding without even understanding someone's point.
Let me show you what I read in this man's final words:
>>> First I would like to say I have been here since September 2005. I had the honor and privilege to know many prison guards and staff. I want to thank all of them. I would like for everyone to write the people on death row as they are all good men and I am very happy I got to know them. All of their lives are worth knowing about.
That sounds nice but also quite proud. Fine, he's not particularly sorry about his crime, if you even want to call it that. It was all in the distant past anyway, so why make a fuss about it. There's no one left alive who really cared about the old woman anyway, so it would be pointless to apologize "to all the people I hurt". That sort of victimolotry would ring false anyway (unless it's a victim of the state), so point in his favor for honesty. Hmm, I wonder what else he's telling the truth about.
He says the people on death row are all "good men" and he's "very happy" he got to know them. That's pretty interesting and contrary to intuition. Most of us would be very unhappy to spend decades around violent criminals. A charitable interpretation is that he's made close friendships over time and is generally loyal. But many have said you can know a man by his friends, so it also suggests bad judgment or, perhaps, a tendency to narcissistic splitting. His statement definitely isn't concerned with their crimes or guilt.
>>> Secondly on February 14th the medical examiner and the chief nurse were engaged in numerous false illegal acts. They tried to cover up that thousands were wrongfully convicted by Matt Powell, district attorney. This needs to be brought to justice. I call upon the FBI to investigate Matt Powell and the Lubbock County Medical Examiner.
Whoa, that's weird. He expresses no concern for crimes committed by his fellow inmates but does want to point out the malfeasance of the state. This makes a kind of sense, whether it's true or not. I do wonder how much he knows about this. Does he know a lot because he was claiming this as part of his appeal and he believes he is innocent? Is that credible? Does the fact of malfeasance mean the crimes weren't committed or only that civil rights of criminals (due process) were violated?
If he's been claiming he's innocent all these years, it would explain why he doesn't mention his conviction in his last words. But again, what was the evidence of his innocence or guilt? If the evidence is reasonable that he is, in fact, guilty then he's carrying his lie to the grave. That'd be interesting, no?
It's also interesting that he's using his "platform" to call attention to this issue, ostensibly to save innocent men (like him?) from wrongful conviction. Maybe he is innocent. I don't know. They say all men in prison are innocent. Or maybe he's guilty and has been lying about it for so long that he's lost connection to reality. Or maybe he's knowingly lying to the bitter end. Questions to be asked...
>>> Lastly, I was born and raised Catholic and it was not lost upon me that this is Holy Week and last Sunday was Palm Sunday. Yesterday was my birthday. Today is the day I join my God and father. The state may have my body but not my soul. In order to save my brothers on death row I call upon Pope Francis and all the people of the world.
Now this is interesting. A black man in Texas raised Catholic is a rarity. He's got some pretty overt martyrdom symbolism going on here. His birthday is coinciding with Holy Week? If you're not familiar here's the significance:
"Palm Sunday commemorates the entrance of Christ into Jerusalem, when palm branches were placed in his path, before his arrest on Holy Thursday and his crucifixion on Good Friday. It thus marks the beginning of Holy Week, the final week of Lent." (Wikipedia)
Maybe that's just copium but he isn't much of a theologian if he is, in fact, guilty, as that would require confession and repentance to save his soul. If he doesn't do that part, the state would still have his body, but God would be sending his soul to hell. Maybe he confessed elsewhere with his priest and chose not to repeat his confession publicly. That's his right. Still, it raises suspicions about his state of mind and his character. Similarly, his call upon Pope Francis doesn't make much sense. Francis already issued a bull against the death penalty. Even so, as a Catholic, he would know the pope isn't needed to save the souls of his "brothers on death row", only a confession and repentance before an ordained priest. And as a Catholic so close to death, he would also know that is the only "saving" that would help them. The last thing that would help them is to be affirmed in false protestations of innocence. So, again, what's he thinking? He surely knows that most of the "good men" on death row did commit their crimes. And that most of the "good men" on death row are claiming innocence. If anything, as a Catholic he should be calling upon his "brothers on death row" to confess their crimes and repent before a priest. But that's not what he's doing. Why?
>>> Lastly, I want everyone to boycott every single business in the state of Texas until all the businesses are pressed to stop the death penalty.
Based on other things he said, I believe he is mentally coherent, but this statement makes little sense. Businesses don't execute convicts, the state does. This call to action would punish all people in Texas regardless of their support for the death penalty. Why would he want to do that? Faith, hope, and charity are the cardinal Catholic virtues. It's not very charitable to punish the innocent. If he is himself innocent, then why would he want to punish other innocents? Is he acting in a spirit of resentment? I don't know. But it makes me wonder about the degree of his sincerity. It would make more sense if he was calling upon the people of Texas to end the death penalty in order to save their own souls. But he doesn't say that.
(As an aside, the history of the Catholic position on the death penalty is pretty long and the period after the 1970s is unique in its opposition to the death penalty. The catechism wasn't officially revised until 2018, so this is a pretty recent thing. Is it coincidental that the changes track pretty well with the rise of "Liberation Theology"? I don't know. Pope Benedict XVI was no liberationist but he was also on record advocating abolition, so there's that.)
>>> With that Lord I commend my spirit. Warden I am ready to join my father.”
Not trying to be harsh but if he's a Catholic and he's guilty and he hasn't confessed and repented and there is a God and the Catholic faith is correct, then he's going straight to hell.
So, I hope that clarifies the spirit of my parent comment, which was a lament about the lack of trust created by the commission of crimes. I'm not digging into his case, just pointing out that, to an attentive reader, there's a lot to unpack in this short statement.