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Mercedes and Ferrari’s edge in the electric car age: high-end axial motors

bloomberg.com

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Re: Mercedes and Ferrari’s edge in the electric car age: high-end axial motors

#271

Post by ohgodplsno »

alliao wrote: post #266
ohgodplsno wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, italian highways are a terrifying zone of lawlessness and dangerous drivers, Ferraris or not. -- A traumatized french driver

lol some time later a local Italian told me there're no police no speed camera on Italian highways, I didn't know what to believe to be honest, any Italians around? hah

There are speed cameras, but they're well indicated, stationary and even Google Maps warns you in advance when you're getting close to one. Police, I've never seen.

Re: Mercedes and Ferrari’s edge in the electric car age: high-end axial motors

#272

Post by suction »

papito wrote: post #212
dagw wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Club" can mean both a private members club with various facilities, including a bar, as well as a place where people party and dance all night to loud music.

Why try and look for a hidden meaning in something that is obvious? That sounds exhausting. It's weird enough that Musk claimed he was sad-drinking in a club, but now we are discussing the idea of him sad-drinking in a country club , a place for old, rich, white men who go there to play golf - where he was then approached by a young model?

No post body was provided.

Re: Mercedes and Ferrari’s edge in the electric car age: high-end axial motors

#273

Post by suction »

beeboop wrote: post #253
suction wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla quality is still lightyears behind old premium brands. Panel gaps so wide you could use them as kiddie pools. Their scrap rates are testament of how crappy their production process is.

Do you have a source for Tesla's scrap rates and the scrap rates for other large manufacturers?

In that dreaded plant in Germany it’s a cool 60% currently:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/efahrer.chip.de/news/ueber-60-p...

Re: Mercedes and Ferrari’s edge in the electric car age: high-end axial motors

#274

Post by lm28469 »

mhh__ wrote: post #258
lm28469 wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How many Ferraris do you see every day ? For every Ferrari you have hundreds of 1970-80s diesel cars which pollute just as much in every city centers

How often do you see a car from the 80s still on the road?

oof, every single day, they easily outnumber ferraris

Re: Mercedes and Ferrari’s edge in the electric car age: high-end axial motors

#275

Post by hoseja »

dmitriid wrote: post #149
awestroke wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because it is prohibitively expensive, and you get more data with multiple cameras than with one single lidar

> you get more data with multiple cameras than with one single lidar Until you're at night in the snow/dirt.

Yeah, lidar famously deals well with inclement weather and low visibility conditions. Those infrared lasers just punch right through the fog and snowflakes.

Lmao.

Re: Mercedes and Ferrari’s edge in the electric car age: high-end axial motors

#276

Post by albertopv »

throwaway0a5e wrote: post #195
benj111 wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When everyone has EVs the sound of any IC is going to become increasingly noticeable. I can see a point where IC vehicles are banned from cities on noise grounds alone.

When 99.99% of cars are EV the common man will not care about the rare ICE car that comes along anymore than he cares when he sees the DPW driving a backhoe down the street. By the time the long tail of "people driving old junk" is narrow enough for banning ICEs to be politically palatable the bulk of the people screeching about it now will have picked up some more pressing issue and be caring about that instead.

Not going to happen in 50 years, probably more. I still see a lot of >20 yo cars, lots of people simply can't afford a new or even used car. Let alone trucks: my father was a concrete mixer truck owner (sorry I don't know exact word for that), when fully loaded the truck run 300 meters with one liters of diesel, it's more than 30 liters per 100kms.

Re: Mercedes and Ferrari’s edge in the electric car age: high-end axial motors

#277

Post by throwawaylinux »

h0l0cube wrote: post #226
throwawaylinux wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Terrible choice of guiding stars. So you confess your extremist heretical beliefs in denying the integrity, honesty, and expertise in the ruling of society of these people? Sounds like a dangerous, seditious thing to think. > The scientists that have been studying this and raising the alarm bells since the 70s Of course, I would never doubt The Science of climate change. What I am talking about is what we should do…

> dangerous, seditious thing to think I think maybe you're spending too much time online. > and those experts Not sure why you keep calling political entities 'experts'. They are definitely experts of their political domains, but this claim of their prime importance on climate change matters seems to be your own. To go back to what I'm guessing is your concern: No one's coming to steal your right to drive a Tesla, bu…

> I think maybe you're spending too much time online.

I'm dutifully reciting what the experts tell me offline.

> Not sure why you keep calling political entities 'experts'. They are definitely experts of their political domains, but this claim of their prime importance on climate change matters seems to be your own.

I'm not, I'm calling the ruling class experts at ruling and running society.

> To go back to what I'm guessing is your concern:

That's not my concern.

> No one's coming to steal your right to drive a Tesla, but more people might just opt to not own their own vehicle, as public transport options improve. If 50 years from now, people are able to use shared transport to get door-to-door from city A to city B, and at a similar (or better) speed, for less money, the demand for vehicles may drop. As autonomous vehicles are getting better, it's only a matter of time.

For the commoners, of course. Naturally the experts would still permit themselves to fly around in their private jets and yachts, etc. It's for the greater good, according to the experts.

Re: Mercedes and Ferrari’s edge in the electric car age: high-end axial motors

#278

Post by rsynnott »

ZeroGravitas wrote: post #197
clouddrover wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those are US figures. The North American EV market is about one third the size of the European market. Here are some current European sales percentages: https://eu-evs.com/marketShare/ALL/Groups/Line/All-time-by-Y... Tesla comes in 4th.

And its probably fair to attribute the difference to better governance in the EU, so the top down approach that worked for Tesla wasn't as necessary. Still useful to have someone targetting Silicon Valley nerds that would otherwise own a Prius and a Porsche though.

Eh, I'm not sure that's true, really. Europe has been a bit more proactive (and consistent) in encouraging electric cars than the US has, but I think a lot of it comes down to market differences:

- Fuel in Europe is on the order of 2x the price vs the US (largely due to low tax on petrol in the US)

- Average European journey in nearly all countries is much shorter than average journey in the US (things are closer together, less cultural tolerance for very long commutes)

- Differing consumer preferences in cars (the US _loves_ large SUVs and pickup trucks, which pose greater challenges to electrification than, say, hatchbacks)

- Electric cars are or at least were a cultural/political issue in the US in a way they're not in Europe. It would be deeply weird to be ideologically opposed to, specifically, electric cars in Europe, but that's quite common in the US.

All of this makes Europe an easier-to-address and safer market for the manufacturers than the US, so they targeted the US _first_. That doesn't mean they weren't interested in the US too. For instance, VW sensibly never released its eUp or eGolf in the US, because there's a tiny market for cars like that there. It also won't release its i3, but it will release its i4, which suits US consumer preferences better.

Incidentally, I think the US does have some _advantages_ as a market for electric cars, too. In particular, it's much more common to have a driveway or garage in the US than in Europe, and this makes at-home charging much easier.

Re: Mercedes and Ferrari’s edge in the electric car age: high-end axial motors

#279

Post by bombcar »

chasd00 wrote: post #231
bombcar wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The idea of a motor on each wheel independent has obviously been considered, but what is often ignored is the sprung vs unsprung weight. You could develop a pretty amazing off-road vehicle with independent electric motors in each wheel, but it would be a relatively bumpy ride.

Don’t those giant mining dump trucks have electric motors on each wheel? Although that’s probably for the low rpm torque advantage like diesel electric trains.

They do, primarily so they don't have to have anything resembling a "driveshaft" or a transmission, because they're so big they don't actually "bump" over anything, more like crush it into submission.

Re: Mercedes and Ferrari’s edge in the electric car age: high-end axial motors

#280

Post by dmitriid »

hoseja wrote: post #275
dmitriid wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> you get more data with multiple cameras than with one single lidar Until you're at night in the snow/dirt.

Yeah, lidar famously deals well with inclement weather and low visibility conditions. Those infrared lasers just punch right through the fog and snowflakes. Lmao.

Ah you decided to be smart and sarcastic, and inadvertently showed just how limited the tech in these "autonomous" cars is.

And that you can't just handwave these problems away.

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