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Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

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Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

#271

Post by hervature »

ForHackernews wrote: post #267
smabie wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

plight: "a dangerous, difficult, or otherwise unfortunate situation." Pretty sure a business can have plight.

Maybe we're getting a little philosophical here, but I don't believe inanimate entities can experience "difficulty" or "misfortune". Would you say that a rock suffers "misfortune" if it topples off a cliff into the sea? Is it "difficult" for a glacier to maintain its integrity in the face of global warming? Is my car unfortunate to have been scratched in a parking lot? (OK, I do believe that last one, but I'm anthrop…

Definitely philosophical. If we can use statements like “a business had a bad quarter” and “a business had a good quarter” and understand that these mean that the financial statements were negative/positive. It isn’t a stretch to say something like “a business has had 10 straight bad quarters” is a plight considering a business can cease to exist.

Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

#272

Post by meragrin_ »

claudiulodro wrote: post #52
unethical_ban wrote: post #21

Occasionally, Twitter provides some nice insights in digestible forms (of course, nuance gets stripped). I saw a post recently that said something like "We watch Star Trek and marvel at their post-scarcity world. We are living in a post-scarcity world now, but all the benefits are being funneled by wage slaves up to the 0.1%." Paraphrased. I was talking with a friend who mentioned that a local pizza place is offering…

> Is it because the high-schoolers who would normally do that aren't looking for jobs due to pandemic? The concept that entry-level food service is mostly staffed by high-schoolers who don't really "need" the money is the weirdest trope. Basically every restaurant is open during school hours. Who is handling the lunch rush?

My high school had a thing where students could work during school hours. My sister did it.

Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

#273

Post by [deleted] »

fshbbdssbbgdd wrote: post #242
jschveibinz wrote: post #2

This article unfortunately doesn't address the business side of the problem. Fast food restaurants, or place like "Dale's" mentioned in the article, make very little profit. It is most likely below 10%. Here is an estimate: https://www.restaurant365.com/blog/what-is-the-average-profi... . A 10% profit is very modest. That's not the story of the "fat cats getting rich on the back of the workers" that the article is al…

I think the effects of price stickiness (on goods and labor) aren’t being adequately considered in these discussions. Yes, these restaurants could raise their wages to compete with unemployment, and many have. They’ll also need to raise their prices, which they have leeway to do, because everyone is facing the same costs. The problem occurs in a few months when the bonus unemployment runs out. Then there will be mill…

[deleted]

Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

#274

Post by throwawaygh »

jschveibinz wrote: post #2

This article unfortunately doesn't address the business side of the problem. Fast food restaurants, or place like "Dale's" mentioned in the article, make very little profit. It is most likely below 10%. Here is an estimate: https://www.restaurant365.com/blog/what-is-the-average-profi... . A 10% profit is very modest. That's not the story of the "fat cats getting rich on the back of the workers" that the article is al…

> But they will, they will go down the street

But... why? To save a couple bucks on a burger? This is a serious question.

Is this really how consumer behavior works in the restaurant industry? Restaurant food isn't actually a commodity. A burger from one place can be quite different from a burger at another. Even at the low end -- I much prefer McD's to the other fast food joints. Atmospheres can be very different as well, even at the low end. Etc.

This is not at all how I behave. I have two local bars. I like both way more than all the other bars. I have one local brunch place I like way more than all the other brunch places. All 3 places can & have increased prices. In one case substantially. I go anyways.

Granted, I have more expendable income than the average American. But this is even how I behaved when I was on a pretty tight budget during grad school -- a few regular places and I went as much as I could within my budget.

Maybe I'm just a weirdo?

Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

#275

Post by FFRefresh »

ForHackernews wrote: post #267
smabie wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

plight: "a dangerous, difficult, or otherwise unfortunate situation." Pretty sure a business can have plight.

Maybe we're getting a little philosophical here, but I don't believe inanimate entities can experience "difficulty" or "misfortune". Would you say that a rock suffers "misfortune" if it topples off a cliff into the sea? Is it "difficult" for a glacier to maintain its integrity in the face of global warming? Is my car unfortunate to have been scratched in a parking lot? (OK, I do believe that last one, but I'm anthrop…

Is a group of people an inanimate entity to you? Are there only certain types of groups of people that you think are an animate entity?

Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

#276

Post by seiferteric »

colinmhayes wrote: post #33
unethical_ban wrote: post #21

Occasionally, Twitter provides some nice insights in digestible forms (of course, nuance gets stripped). I saw a post recently that said something like "We watch Star Trek and marvel at their post-scarcity world. We are living in a post-scarcity world now, but all the benefits are being funneled by wage slaves up to the 0.1%." Paraphrased. I was talking with a friend who mentioned that a local pizza place is offering…

We aren't actually living in a post scarcity world though. We're moving in the right direction, and hopefully we get there soon, but there is still plenty of scarcity.

Not even close, maybe if we ignore the obscene externalities baked into everything we consume. This apparent bounty we have today will be short lived in the grand scheme.

Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

#277

Post by maxerickson »

inetknght wrote: post #257
maxerickson wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm glad I don't have to fit my expenses into a minimum wage budget, but some of your numbers are pretty high. I buy gas once every 2 or 3 weeks and spend $45 on a phone plan with 4 GB of LTE (US; I guess that can fit the definition of basically no internet). My car insurance (with collision and unlimited medical) is less than $500 for 6 months. I would probably balk at paying much more than $800 in rent. The rental…

> but some of your numbers are pretty high. Cost of living across the US varies wildly. The numbers are pulled from my most recent billing cycle for Houston and partly extrapolated to minimum wage (which I am most definitely not , but have friends who are). My rent is $1500/mo for 920sqft inside the 610 loop. The leasing office wanted $2000/mo for new contracts in October last year. It's really hard to find places fo…

Are people doing office work for $7.25 in Houston?

I agree that prices vary widely, I'm not sure it makes sense to take expensive places as typical.

Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

#278

Post by WalterBright »

myself248 wrote: post #241
drdeadringer wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I worked on a (US) Naval shipyard for a spell. The number of payday loan shops in the immediate surrounding area was astounding. I kept hearing word of "Don't Do Payday" financial help training for the Naval crew, who apparently were a prime target for the industry. Before working there, I had little idea such existed. Think "worse than 'cash your cheque here'" places. I don't know how many Naval folks I worked with…

Some years back, I was on a jobsite where radios were allowed, and we rotated through the crew, everyone playing deejay for a day, so everyone's taste got represented. Some guys would bring in a stack of CDs, some would just play the radio. It meant I listened to a few stations I don't normally listen to. And the density of payday loan ads, on some stations but not others, blew my mind. I don't think I ever heard one…

> that we could support?

One of the most effective anti-poverty programs the government could do is teach basic accounting and finance as core curriculum in the public schools.

Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

#279

Post by j1elo »

inetknght wrote: post #164
gruez wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I've long felt that many jobs paid unsustainably low wages. Can you elaborate on this? $7.25 * 8 hours = $58. It's hard to imagine expenses adding up anywhere close to $58/day, especially if you factor in that in high cost of living areas the minimum wage is also higher than $7.25.

> Can you elaborate on this? $7.25 8 hours = $58. It's hard to imagine expenses adding up anywhere close to $58/day, especially if you factor in that in high cost of living areas the minimum wage is also higher than $7.25.* Wow can you be any more out of touch? Your comment is offensively innaccurate. $58/day = $1740 for 30 days Unhealthy cheap carbs for a single person... $200/month (chicken, beans, rice, milk, chee…

> Vehicle insurance on an old vehicle: $300/mo

Wow. In Spain you would pay between €150 to 200 per year of insurance for the typical old cheap car. 400/year for a nice, semi luxury one. I knew some things were expensive in the States, but this particular one surprised me a lot.

Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?

#280

Post by judge2020 »

maybelsyrup wrote: post #256
jschveibinz wrote: post #2

This article unfortunately doesn't address the business side of the problem. Fast food restaurants, or place like "Dale's" mentioned in the article, make very little profit. It is most likely below 10%. Here is an estimate: https://www.restaurant365.com/blog/what-is-the-average-profi... . A 10% profit is very modest. That's not the story of the "fat cats getting rich on the back of the workers" that the article is al…

> This article unfortunately doesn't address the business side of the problem. Good! I've been hearing about "the business side of the problem" my entire life -- lectured sternly about it, in many cases. All while few of the Adults and Experts - people with Real Power, in other words - dare even mention some of the topics laid out in the link. > I'm just saying that both sides of the equation need to be examined, i.e…

'suffering' for a business is just code for being on a path towards the workers suffering the consequences of no profit. That might mean not paying shareholders dividends and the company's share price losing value, but not all companies are public or pay dividends. If the money runs out, suddenly the business can't pay rent or pay the workers and thus goes bankrupt. No, the business's feelings aren't being hurt and it's not being physically assaulted.
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