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Changes to sharing and viewing news on Facebook in Australia

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Re: Changes to sharing and viewing news on Facebook in Australia

#271

Post by hnick »

scribu wrote: post #18
endisneigh wrote: post #15

Could someone summarize both positions? It seems pretty reasonable to me - my understanding is that Australia wants Google and Facebook to pay lump sums to have their content on their platforms (as opposed to per-click). Google and Facebook can basically say yes or no. How is this different than, say, The New York Times saying the same thing about their content?

I think this article on simple linking vs. previewing sums up the issue: https://theconversation.com/webs-inventor-says-news-media-ba...

I don't know the legal status but I've always been uneasy about rich snippets and other things on Google search. It is common that I get my answer and never have to visit the site, meaning Google gets their ad money and the site gets nothing more than a name drop.

But you have to play that silly game, because otherwise your competitor might get featured instead and we learn about them and not you.

Re: Changes to sharing and viewing news on Facebook in Australia

#272

Post by adamjb »

andrewinardeer wrote: post #266

The Bureau of Meteorology, a government department that provides forecasts has just tweeted that their Facebook page has been impacted by this change which is odd as this is not a media company and provides arguably vitally important information to mariners and other transport modes. It looks like the blast radius from this decision is impacting organizations that is out of scope of this legislation. https://twitter.…

The BOM provides vitally important information in disasters too. This will kill people.

Re: Changes to sharing and viewing news on Facebook in Australia

#273

Post by sangnoir »

CydeWeys wrote: post #234
tt433 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not really sure what you mean by impossible

How would you craft legislation that force Google and Facebook to do business with you under terms that you dictate? Ultimately how can you prevent said companies from pulling out of your country entirely if that's the better option for them?

Australia and Facebook did exactly what you described in your "impossible" hypothetical. I suspect the government's thinking was the Australia is too big a market for the victim companies to drop, i.e. they thought this was a deal they could not refuse.

Re: Changes to sharing and viewing news on Facebook in Australia

#274

Post by plasma »

andrewinardeer wrote: post #266

The Bureau of Meteorology, a government department that provides forecasts has just tweeted that their Facebook page has been impacted by this change which is odd as this is not a media company and provides arguably vitally important information to mariners and other transport modes. It looks like the blast radius from this decision is impacting organizations that is out of scope of this legislation. https://twitter.…

Honestly, I feel good about this (I'm Australian too).

It's causing pain to the government now, to put pressure on re-evaluating their ridiculous proposal.

Besides the obvious drawbacks of the proposal, there would also be side-effects that won't be seen until later, and I'm glad the side-effects are being shown right now to try and stop this whole mess.

Re: Changes to sharing and viewing news on Facebook in Australia

#275

Post by james_s_tayler »

Cyclone_ wrote: post #7

Will be interesting to see the social impact on this. I kind of wish sometimes there was a plug-in that could just block news postings on facebook, since I don't go to facebook to see what friends are saying about the news

Just sign up for Facebook through Australia.

Re: Changes to sharing and viewing news on Facebook in Australia

#276

Post by askesum »

leetcrew wrote: post #264
askesum wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Humans are held responsible if they cause harm to others. If a driver hits a pedestrian on purpose he is charged with murder. Who do you charge if a self-driving car behaves in this way?

the humans that designed the car? to be clear, computers don't intentionally do anything. if an engineer deliberately programs a car to hit pedestrians for no reason, they would be charged with murder. if the car hits a pedestrian as a result of an engineering mistake, the company would be liable for damages, and if particularly egregious, engineers might face manslaughter charges.

To be clear, that was my point. You can't punish the computer and good luck finding the one to punish for an accident ten years later. But maybe if it's free software...

Re: Changes to sharing and viewing news on Facebook in Australia

#277

Post by sangnoir »

jjcm wrote: post #270
echevil wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not familiar with news media consumption in Australia, but I wonder would this push users to news aggregators like "News Break" or "Apple News"?

Potentially, but under this law these are likely to also encounter the same issues that Facebook and Google are facing right now. Facebook and Google are only the first named companies affected by this, though the rules are far reaching. I highly suspect things like Apple News would be next on the block to be classified as a "designated digital platform".

I think going after all aggregators would have weakened the government position. The current approach forces Facebook to weigh the likelihood of other orgs getting onto FBs turf, once FB is onboard, the government can go after the others, one at a time. It works better via divide and rule vs having all providers presenting a united front and dropping Australia _en masse_ (which would have a high political cost, vs FB alone which doesn't have a lot of political capital)

Re: Changes to sharing and viewing news on Facebook in Australia

#278

Post by 908B64B197 »

teraflop wrote: post #154
gkmcd wrote: post #60

A key part of this legislation is the requirements for tech companies to provide selected news organisations with advance notice about changes to ranking algorithms. This has been generally overlooked in the reporting and discussion but I believe it is the actually the most important part of the legislation. It will give the selected news organisations an enormous advantage over other companies not included and prote…

It's even broader than that. The law applies to any "alterations to the ways in which a service distributes content". The law never actually defines what this means, but it gives a bunch of examples that go beyond ranking. For example, anything that affects a particular "class of content", such as deciding whether or not to make all videos auto-play, is an alteration. Basically, this law would prevent Facebook from d…

So it's just like GDPR?

Guidelines intentionally kept vague so that some bureaucrat can slap a huge fine and collect the rent?

I wonder if that rent-seeking attitude will accelerate or curb the current brain drain Australia faces.

Re: Changes to sharing and viewing news on Facebook in Australia

#279

Post by denismi »

angry_octet wrote: post #233

Wow they've blocked the Bureau of Meteorology page, no more weather warnings on fb. All of ABC too (our BBC equivalent), though they were not required to pay for ABC content, so it seems pretty bitchy.

The legislation was subsequently amended to include ABC: https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/abc-sbs-included-in-...

(Hopefully YC doesn't have to pay for this link one day)

Re: Changes to sharing and viewing news on Facebook in Australia

#280

Post by AdrianB1 »

offby37years wrote: post #130
pochamago wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The cynical streak in me would suggest that now is a popular time to criticize major tech organs for their relationship to news, and the Australian government is hoping to use that to funnel money from US companies to Australian ones.

If anything, US big tech is and has been siphoning money from the Australia news media for a decade.

How exactly is that? Giving you a link to the news media web site does extract money from them?
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