their tweeter account suspended :(
Why Jira Sucks
271–280 of 530 posts
Re: Why Jira Sucks
#2721. It is dog slow. 2. It is dog slow. 3. It is dog slow. ... When my team had an important as-quickly-as-possible sprint, we dropped Jira and switched to Google Docs as it was much easier and faster than Jira. My conclusion was that Jira doesn't do much for developers that can't be done in some Google Docs/Sheets.
Working on a much faster issue tracker: https://linear.app
We build it so that almost everything you do in the app instant (<100ms)
Re: Why Jira Sucks
#273To me, what sucks about JIRA (and would suck about any well-designed tool that replaces it) is not "feature x" but the entire JIRA mentality. All of it. It encourages micro-management. It encourages more and more process. It is the enemy of getting better at the DORA metrics, which requires streamlining process. tickets in JIRA are not the work itself, never was and never will be, it is a LARP of the work, but it get…
Agree 100%. JIRA is supposed to be a means, not an end itself. Half of my organization believes they are generating value by adding new issues into JIRA. JIRA helps reinforce a dogmatic attitude that the "hows" are more important than the "whys", and thus issues that could be succinctly described in 20 words get expanded into templated "given/when/then" verbiage.
One of the core Agile principles is "individuals and interactions over processes and tools". JIRA is more-or-less value neutral, but the management caste, possibly fearful of the sort of healthy conflict that comes with negotiating the priority of features and fixes, tends to resort to inputing all their information into JIRA believing that it's a substitute for actual communication.
Every Agile resource I've read has emphasized the point that nothing is equal to actual conversation between stakeholders. Whether it's JIRA or one of its competitors, when you have a tool that discourages conversations or pretends to act as a proxy for collaboration between stakeholders, you're going to court failure. Easy to blame JIRA, but it's this whole tool-based mindset.
Re: Why Jira Sucks
#274Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Jira makes it easy to track what's actually going on. No it does not, and I said that above more than once. it makes it easy to track what's in JIRA, that's all. To the extent that it's accurate, it constrains what's "actually going on".
Exactly. What's going on is commits and merges. They live in GitLab. There is also tickets in GitLab, which all developers are happy to use. There is a wiki as well, which, gosh, is just markdown in another repo! Markdown you can build beautiful PDFs from! And websites! But nope, we need JIRA and confluence, because for some reason GitLab isn't good enough. Now the tickets are separate from the actual work, there is…
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Re: Why Jira Sucks
#275Earlier quoted context omitted.
I 100% disagree. Fixing a bug or delivering a feature where you haven't documented the process, (how the criteria were decided, when it was tested and deployed) is as good a running a web site nobody visits. JIRA hate comes from the bottom up. Developers don't like having to have their work parceled out so specifically. But it's not for them. It's for managers and stakeholders who have to report progress and who are…
> And I've also never worked anywhere that had a better option than JIRA. Agree with most of what you say aside from this bit. I find most similar systems are in the same ballpark in terms of being able to track what I care about. Mainly: - Is the ticket ready for me to work on? (Do I have the designs I need to work it?) - Who is working on a given ticket right now? - Am I done with a ticket? - Is the ticket ready fo…
GitHub does all of this very well.
"Ticket" => GitHub issue
"status" => current column on GitHub project. This includes "is the ticket ready for me", "am I done with a ticket", "is the ticket ready for QA", "did QA reject the ticket", etc. -- each of these is a column in the project board.
"who is working on it" => assignee(s)
Re: Why Jira Sucks
#276Earlier quoted context omitted.
I 100% disagree. Fixing a bug or delivering a feature where you haven't documented the process, (how the criteria were decided, when it was tested and deployed) is as good a running a web site nobody visits. JIRA hate comes from the bottom up. Developers don't like having to have their work parceled out so specifically. But it's not for them. It's for managers and stakeholders who have to report progress and who are…
> Fixing a bug or delivering a feature where you haven't documented the process, (how the criteria were decided, when it was tested and deployed) is as good a running a web site nobody visits. Sorry but what? You might need to expand on this. As far as I'm concerned, when a bug is fixed then the value of that fix is realised by the users. I don't see how this is not valuable just because you manager didn't get to eye…
For the short term, yes. For the long term, if you do not document the reasons of the changes, eventually you will not remember what the reason was for that change.
In software products with enough large bases, some changes decisions affect other users, who eventually might request the change in the opposite direction.
You do not want to lose the rationale behind the original change/fix.
Keep in mind that what is a bug for some users is a feature for others: https://xkcd.com/1172/
Re: Why Jira Sucks
#277Earlier quoted context omitted.
Jira Cloud has a new editor that is Markdownesque. Type as if you're using Markdown, and it will do the formatting you'd expect.
From your description, it sounds like this would have Slack's problem (which resulted in one of the most upvoted HN threads of all time, https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21589647 ). I've tried Googling around a bit to find an example of Jira Cloud's Markdown environment, but couldn't find one. (I am certainly biased, though, by my strong loathing of Jira.)
FWIW, I prefer Jira's editor to Slack's.
Re: Why Jira Sucks
#278I really enjoy JIRA.
Re: Why Jira Sucks
#279Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Atlassian seems to make a lot of money, so I guess they're optimising for something that matters to someone My personal theory about Atlassian: they have realized (like SAP did before) that once you convinced management to use your product you no longer need to worry about what the users think. You don't like that the ticket form has 50 fields you don't need? No problem! All you need to do is to convince your manag…
>My personal theory about Atlassian: they have realized (like SAP did before) that once you convinced management to use your product you no longer need to worry about what the users think. That's all enterprise software in a nutshell. And a huge reason why things like Slack and Trello became so popular. They targeted users first without having to get the enterprise to buy it up front.
I think trello is fine. Its so simple and fast and not trying to overachieve. Or did Atlassian already screw it up?
Re: Why Jira Sucks
#280To me, what sucks about JIRA (and would suck about any well-designed tool that replaces it) is not "feature x" but the entire JIRA mentality. All of it. It encourages micro-management. It encourages more and more process. It is the enemy of getting better at the DORA metrics, which requires streamlining process. tickets in JIRA are not the work itself, never was and never will be, it is a LARP of the work, but it get…
I 100% disagree. Fixing a bug or delivering a feature where you haven't documented the process, (how the criteria were decided, when it was tested and deployed) is as good a running a web site nobody visits. JIRA hate comes from the bottom up. Developers don't like having to have their work parceled out so specifically. But it's not for them. It's for managers and stakeholders who have to report progress and who are…
> ...you haven't documented the process...
How does JIRA help with that?
I'd LOVE an unauthorized documentary revealing how Atlassian dog foods JIRA.
My $100 bet: They don't.
While Atlassian has great confidence for how you should run your projects, what they do internally bears no resemblance to that sage advice.