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Oracle Moving HQ to Austin

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Re: Oracle Moving HQ to Austin

#271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

no idea why but that page is essentially unreadable here on both firefox 83.0 and chrome. I do use ublock origin and 68k lines in /etc/hosts to block stuff, but still ...

Seems like the AdAway hosts list blocks assets.dwell.com for some reason... Not entirely sure why.

Yep, that was it. Thanks for that. I'll remember the next time something like that happens to search for the domain in /etc/hosts

Re: Oracle Moving HQ to Austin

#272

Why is it so hard to realize that people want low taxes and light regulation? And that woke culture with it's free speech curtailment are a kind of 1984 environment where someone is watching your words constantly. California and NYC were great great states, and after decades of democrat governments, companies decide to move thousands of kilometers so they can leave these states in favor of Republican states. There's…

Well your political fantasy happens to be wrong. California experiences a net influx of highly skilled workers draining them from the rest of the US ( https://www.jec.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/republicans/2019... ) and red states mostly lose their brightest people or absorb California residents from older failing industries who can’t afford the rents. The majority of this is about cost of living not taxes. Corporat…

There's a chicken and egg situation. Companies do choose to locate in California because of talent, but talent also chooses California because of great companies. If enough great companies leave, the talent will leave, too.

Re: Oracle Moving HQ to Austin

#273

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Californians in LA/SF are used to paying $800k for a house, and the Cali salaries are high enough to support it. A Texan in Dallas/Austin is used to paying $250k for that same house, and has a relatively lower salary to match. The Californians, after years of having higher salary, more savings, and a job that lets them move, goes to Texas and offers $400k for that same house. The Californian thinks it's a great deal,…

I remember in the mid-90s, living in Seattle just as one wave of "californication" was drawing to a close and just before the tech boom would start an even crazier rise in housing costs there .... listening to some local talk radio show. A caller was complaining about Californians coming to WA/Seattle and doing just what you describe. The radio host said "well, it takes two to tango, those prices going up reflect the…

Doesn't seem like mid-90s property appreciation in Seattle could have been pinned on Californians anyway. Wouldn't it have been more related to Microsoft, a gigantic and extremely successful company with an in-house Porsche dealership among other perks?

I see a similar defective thought process right here in Berkeley, CA. Everyone here blames housing demand on peninsula companies like Facebook, Apple, and Google but it's a fact that employment right here in the city of Berkeley has been allowed to double in the last 30 years while the city built zero net dwellings. We can try to blame it on distant villains but the gentrification, to borrow a meme, is coming from inside the house.

Re: Oracle Moving HQ to Austin

#274
post #42

Likely irrelevant, but reminded me of this[0]: """Basically, we’re moving because of William Whyte‘s rule: virtually all corporate relocations involve a move to a location which is closer to the CEO’s home than the old location. Whyte discovered this principle after an extensive study of Fortune 500 companies that left New York City for the suburbs in the 1950s and 1960s""" Tesla will likely move its HQ to Texas foll…

Interesting, somehow I don’t think how companies where run in the 1950-1960 translates to today Look at the google ML firing/resigning storm, in the 50s someone fired end of story not the CEO saying they will investigate (honesty transparency aside)

In the 1950's without modern media, social networks, etc., it was a lot easier to sweep some scandal or other major bit of unpleasantness under the rug.

Re: Oracle Moving HQ to Austin

#275

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If California can claim the work was done in or for California. They’ll tax it. If you work remote from Texas but hr says your desk is in California. You owe California taxes.

This is categorically false. If you're a Texas resident, working for a California based company, but doing your work remotely in Texas, you absolutely do not owe taxes in California. The concept of "work done for California" does not exist. If the work is done in Texas (at your house), you pay Texas taxes (no income tax).

There is some nuance to this. CA deliberately defines anybody who is in CA "other than for a transitory purpose" as a CA resident (for tax purposes). So if you happen to reside in TX but come to Redwood City for a couple weeks and work there, for example, CA can come after you. I am fairly certain this will happen more often once increasing numbers of people vote with their feet.

Re: Oracle Moving HQ to Austin

#276

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Yes. And it can be impacted at a municipality level, as well as a state or county level too. So the city of Seattle might have a different way they tax these things than the city of Redmond, in addition to whatever taxes are levied by King County or Washington State. ETA: there are very real reasons big companies have reconfigured workspaces and it isn’t about worker efficiency studies or even fitting more people int…

This is news to me. Could you provide some reading material on this topic?

Look up B&O taxes. There’s often a square footage requirement to it and depending on where you are, there can be a surcharge or additional fee for what they deem distinct workspaces. So if it has a door, that’s a new place. Whereas open and more disparate spaces do not. Again, all of this is extremely dependent on where you operate and can vary based on what type of business you’re in, etc. etc.

I wish I had more direct information. I was informed of this by a tax attorney, when I was complaining about how our shared employer was shifting away from individual offices, which had been a hallmark of the company and corporate culture. He told me that there had been some changes to the local B&O tax law that helped make the argument to to shared/team/open spaces. I did some research and found he was right, though again, the specifics are going to differ depending on where you are, what business you’re in, the size of the business, etc.

Re: Oracle Moving HQ to Austin

#277
post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. And it can be impacted at a municipality level, as well as a state or county level too. So the city of Seattle might have a different way they tax these things than the city of Redmond, in addition to whatever taxes are levied by King County or Washington State. ETA: there are very real reasons big companies have reconfigured workspaces and it isn’t about worker efficiency studies or even fitting more people int…

This isn't true. The move to the open office was NOT because of a city tax on the number of private offices. For this to be remotely true someone would need to audit each building / floor. Could you point to a government website with additional information?

It’s not the only reason. It’s certainly a reason in certain areas. Research B&O tax laws and loopholes and the intricacies therein.

Re: Oracle Moving HQ to Austin

#278
post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It means less taxes and less strict labor laws. Not for people that remain in CA, WFH or not. For those that move to TX, what you said applies.

This can also paint a target on non TX workers. I have lived through that. HQ of a company I worked for in the past moved to TX and anyone that was not willing to relocate was part of the layoffs. Of course, it didn't start off that way. People were initially told they would be fine where they were. Our California office went from several hundred to six people.

Let me guess.. hp?

Re: Oracle Moving HQ to Austin

#280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

based on the skyrocketing real estate prices in Phoenix, I suspect many Californians are moving to AZ.

About 60k people moved from CA to AZ last year (latest available data), making it the #2 destination. Of course, California is also by far the largest destination of people who move out of Arizona. They are adjacent states after all and Phoenix is, let's face it, basically in Los Angeles already.

What was #1? TX?
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