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Apple's apps bypass firewalls like LittleSnitch and LuLu on macOS Big Sur

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Re: Apple's apps bypass firewalls like LittleSnitch and LuLu on macOS Big Sur

#271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Additionally charging on the left side ports makes the T2 chip overheat and crashes the machine on occasion.

What if you have a model with ports only on the left-hand side? Does it crash it as well?

Mine doesn’t.

Re: Apple's apps bypass firewalls like LittleSnitch and LuLu on macOS Big Sur

#272
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I install Little Snitch, it's because I trust Little Snitch to be responsible for my computer's network traffic, over and above anyone else. I recognize that this won't necessarily apply to all users or all apps, but there needs to be a way for the user to designate trust. Apple services and traffic should not get special treatment.

They provide the OS. If you don't trust them, then you shouldn't trust anything running on top of it either...

This really isn't about trusting Apple, this is about trusting Little Snitch. I don't think it would be a good decision to allow any app to control your firewall, but I should be able to say "this app should be allowed to because I trust it."

Re: Apple's apps bypass firewalls like LittleSnitch and LuLu on macOS Big Sur

#273
post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The linux desktop experience is still quite in a state. I will likely do the same and suffer Linux, but I think many will go back to windows as WSL continues to improve. Apple is going to lose developers.

I switched to Windows and been working exclusively on WSL2. It is pretty decent and I'm glad I got out of Apple ecosystem.

I'll second this sentiment.. After setting up WSL2 I figured I would move between my iMac and my Windows machine, and I honestly haven't touched my iMac in forever for any dev work.

I'll miss some apps like Omnigraffle (not looking for alternate suggestions thanks), but I can live with that if it means using an OS that respects me enough to let me control it the way I want.

Re: Apple's apps bypass firewalls like LittleSnitch and LuLu on macOS Big Sur

#274

Both major consumer OS vendors seem hell-bent on bringing the OS layer under their complete control. As a power user, it's very frustrating. Meanwhile "desktop" Linux still kind of sucks, just like it did 10 years ago. I don't have much hope of seeing a compelling, unified UX out of Linux in my lifetime.

What is it about Adobe software that makes it only work on Windows or macOS? Both of their graphics engines are totally different, so what makes it so difficult for Linux compatibility? It's the only software package that keeps me beholden to Apple (I'll never run Windows of my own decision).

Adobe doesn't care to support Linux. It's as simple as that.

Re: Apple's apps bypass firewalls like LittleSnitch and LuLu on macOS Big Sur

#275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Linux on the desktop and Linux on the laptop (heh) has definitely improved. It _sometimes_ needs a little tweaking to get it right, but KDE/Plasma also happens to offer that level of "tweakability" that should satisfy almost all semi-mainstream users (at least anyone coming from Windows or Mac). Compared to my first Linux laptop (a Sony Vaio circa 2000), my current XPS 13 works as well as any Mac laptop I have ever o…

I try the major DEs every few years to see if they fit me, most recently trying the newest KDE and GNOME versions in a VM about a month ago. Both have improved for sure, but they still have a long way to go… GNOME actually came closest but its customizability level is even lower than that of macOS, even factoring in extensions. Both suffer from a laundry list of minor annoyances that snowball into something that's ha…

Tried PopOS from System76 recently? It's IMHO the current best user experience of Gnome.

Re: Apple's apps bypass firewalls like LittleSnitch and LuLu on macOS Big Sur

#276
post #21

Apple seems to do all kinds of weird networking _stuff_. For instance, during wakeup, your T2 equipped Macbook will wait for a DNS response and then use said DNS response to synchronize time via NTP before letting the user use the keyboard. Probably checking timestamps on signatures for the keyboard firmware, or something stupid like that. This only happens if it happens to have a default route. Similarly, all macOS…

I was trying to figure out how my routing table was set up on my iPad and I found out that iOS doesn't expose any interface to routing tables, at any level of privilege. Very frustrating.

Re: Apple's apps bypass firewalls like LittleSnitch and LuLu on macOS Big Sur

#277
post #28

"You don't need kernel extensions, we'll provide APIs for you! We won't abuse the power that gives us, promise!" ...and now Apple has altered the deal and we must pray they do not alter it further. Disgusting. Predictable, expected, unsurprising -- but still disgusting.

Dont pray, just dont buy Apple Products

Yeah, I don't think so. I fought with technology since my late teens, and I'm just too old for that shit now. I have maybe an hour to spend on freetime every day and I want to spend exactly 0 seconds of it battling with my devices.

Apple gives me that. Ubuntu gives me that these days in some limited sense too, but not when you factor in AppleTV , phone, pad, homepod and airpod and the watch.

Re: Apple's apps bypass firewalls like LittleSnitch and LuLu on macOS Big Sur

#278
post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could (and perhaps would) make the same argument about Intel (for providing the processor) or Broadcom (for providing the wifi chip) or Comcast (for providing internet service). And it's true, all of these parties have the ability to use their positions for nefarious purposes. However, I would like to limit that potential as much as possible, partly by creating a stigma against practices that remove control from…

I find it interesting how the needs of legitimate security mesh so well with the industry desires to kill off general-purpose computing for the majority of users

I mean the irony is when it comes to browsers you see the general tone of HN shift to the opposite opinion when it comes to features like, RTC, USB, Bluetooth, Filesystem Access. These are all features that give users more power but it's (apparently) easier to see the downsides and how these features can and are used maliciously.

Now put yourself in the Apple's position where "an iOS app" or a "mac App" is about as trusted as a random website. Tech people have a strong culture of locally installed apps being extremely trusted but that doesn't extend to everyone. Can you imagine if websites could control your firewall?

Re: Apple's apps bypass firewalls like LittleSnitch and LuLu on macOS Big Sur

#279

Background: I've written my own kernel extension that works in similar manner to Little Snitch, but does a lot more, including SSL MITM and on-demand packet capture, that I've been using for more than 10 years now. It's a fact that Apple has continuously moved to lock down macOS in ways that are antithetical to folks that want full control over their operating system. To many of us that moved on from Linux on the des…

The linux desktop experience is still quite in a state. I will likely do the same and suffer Linux, but I think many will go back to windows as WSL continues to improve. Apple is going to lose developers.

You have even less control over the OS with Windows 10. Why would anyone move from Mac to Windows for a daily desktop env?

Re: Apple's apps bypass firewalls like LittleSnitch and LuLu on macOS Big Sur

#280

Apple has been more and more acting on the belief that when you buy one of their devices, you don't buy and own the device. You rather purchase an experience—a service—from Apple. They don't have to let you run your own software on your device or poke around the internals. That is not part of the experience offered. You should use the device as Apple intends it to be used.

For better or for worse, this has been Apple’s philosophy since forever. Steve Jobs himself said, “[users] are paying us to make these choices”.

https://youtu.be/rKPEK9BSIhA

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