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Netflix, HBO and Cable Giants Are Coming for Password Sharers

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Re: Netflix, HBO and Cable Giants Are Coming for Password Sharers

#271

Post by antjanus »

joshstrange wrote: post #123
DuskStar wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm willing to concede there are some people stealing who would pay but I can promise you it's nowhere near 100%. Hell, if the situation with games is any indication there are people who will pirate the game after paying for it to get rid of always-on requirements or other intrusive DRM.

I can tell you I know a number of people who pay for Netflix/Amazon Prime/Apple TV+/Hulu/HBO/etc and then turn around and pirate the same content because watching it though Plex/other is simply a better experience. And frankly, I 100% understand where they are coming from: 1. What platform was I watching show X on? 2. Oh Platform X removed show Y? Well it's also on Platform Z but now I can't remember where I was in t…

I really cannot understand how I pay for a service and still get ads. It's ridiculous.

I'm talking about Hulu and Prime. Hulu, I kind of get. It's cheap. I pay $1/month using some special I bought into last year.

Prime though? Every time someone tells me how Prime is comparable to Netflix, it's not. Netflix may autoplay stupid crap while you're looking for a movie (a UX issue) but they don't show me a video ad when I turn on the app, nor do they show me an ad between episodes.

Re: Netflix, HBO and Cable Giants Are Coming for Password Sharers

#272

Post by tracker1 »

rayiner wrote: post #104
tracker1 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even then, imagine not being able to buy any given book at a few different stores. I can get just about any of them on Amazon, B&N and others. Imagine having to go to 6 different stores, with a membership club fee, to check out 6 different books. Vs a single store or library.

You mean like how I can’t buy a Surface at an Apple Store and vice versa?

More like, I can buy an apple or surface at BestBuy, Amazon and a number of other places. Neither is exclusive to where you can only get it at the one place.

Re: Netflix, HBO and Cable Giants Are Coming for Password Sharers

#273

Post by sjy »

diminoten wrote: post #202
LeoNatan25 wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The only reason you can listen to a concert outside of the venue is because there's no way to stop you that's also in any way proportionate to the crime. As is stopping people from pirating. Where there is will, there is a way. The promise of Netflix was that virtually all content (or at least a very large percentage of it) would be there, under one subscription, at optimal quality. And convenience. As years have g…

I agree, I don't think the individual pirates are ever going to be in any real trouble. HOWEVER, while it's impossible to find every person who improperly listened to a concert without paying for a ticket, it is not impossible to find every person who improperly obtained a video file for content they haven't paid for. Just something to keep in mind as we talk about this; you can actually find the people who did it, a…

It’s not just enforcement challenges. There is no law that gives you the right to prevent someone from ‘improperly’ listening to your concert, because restricting that freedom is not seen as a necessary condition for the continued existence of concerts.

Re: Netflix, HBO and Cable Giants Are Coming for Password Sharers

#274

Post by stevenjohns »

Perhaps Neflix, HBO and Cable Giants don't realise that in 2019 the internet is super fast, storage is super cheap and piracy is easier than ever.

If they want to take an inch, I'm prepared to revert to hosting a media server for all of my friends and family with all sorts of wonderful cat videos.

Re: Netflix, HBO and Cable Giants Are Coming for Password Sharers

#275

Post by monocasa »

diminoten wrote: post #196
kempbellt wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>You don't have an entitlement to consume specific content. If it's on the internet and you can access it, yes you do. It's like arguing that if you watch a concert through the fence, rather than paying to get in, you're stealing from the musicians. This "theft" argument is old.

You couldn't be more wrong. You do not have an entitlement to intellectual property, our entire society is built on top of that concept. It's more like you're saying you get to use any logos you want because you can download the images for them on their website. The only reason you can listen to a concert outside of the venue is because there's no way to stop you that's also in any way proportionate to the crime. Edi…

> You do not have an entitlement to intellectual property, our entire society is built on top of that concept.

Our society is based on the idea that the public in fact does have an entitlement to all IP except trademarks. The Constitution is pretty clear that it's a limited monopoly that was originally 14 years for copyright. When that's been perverted so that "forever minus a day" is a limited copyright, then I don't feel the need to respect their property.

Re: Netflix, HBO and Cable Giants Are Coming for Password Sharers

#276

Post by sjy »

zaksoup wrote: post #180
dobleboble wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Convenience does not justify theft. You don't have an entitlement to consume specific content.

I really think we need new language around digital content. I'm not a lawyer but it seems intuitive to say "the reason theft is bad is because you're taking something from somebody else that they, then, no longer have" or "you did not compensate somebody for services that, had they provided those services to somebody else, they would otherwise be compensated for." With digital content this is just not the case. The o…

It’s a big assumption that you wouldn’t have purchased the product anyway. Sure, it’s often true, but there are clearly many people who dislike DRM and subscription fees who would nonetheless accept them if the alternative was to forego copyrighted entertainment altogether. The loss of the opportunity to sell to ‘you’ is not negligible.

Re: Netflix, HBO and Cable Giants Are Coming for Password Sharers

#277

Post by wilg »

lovehashbrowns wrote: post #211
papln wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All people want is everything for a tiny price. They are morally entitled to that, no?

Why are you presenting a straw man and making people seem entitled based on that straw man? That's not at all the issue and has never been. In the channel subscription days, people wanted to be able to select certain channels, like let's say Discovery Channel and History Channel, without having to pay $X base + $Y for the package that has both of those channels. In that case, you're also paying for channels you'll ne…

It's fine to want those things, but I think the "entitlement" idea comes from people who believe it is okay to have those things without paying for them.

It is analogous (or maybe identical) to stealing something you don't need because you think the price is too high. The appropriate response is not to steal it and also not to buy it.

Re: Netflix, HBO and Cable Giants Are Coming for Password Sharers

#278

Post by notatoad »

stevenjohns wrote: post #274

Perhaps Neflix, HBO and Cable Giants don't realise that in 2019 the internet is super fast, storage is super cheap and piracy is easier than ever. If they want to take an inch, I'm prepared to revert to hosting a media server for all of my friends and family with all sorts of wonderful cat videos.

Yeah, i'm a somewhat reformed pirate, and the only reason i've switched from piracy to netflix and prime is because netflix is easier. If it stops being easier, i'll be back to piracy pretty quickly

Re: Netflix, HBO and Cable Giants Are Coming for Password Sharers

#279

Post by pcwalton »

tptacek wrote: post #258
wmorgan wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a timely question with the holidays coming up. A lot of people will be wanting to watch movies from the 1940's and 50's. Many of them don't realize those works are still under copyright. It's not just hypothetical. In our family we subscribe to 3 or 4 streaming services, but last year we still had to pay $5 to watch It's a Wonderful Life (1946), a movie that was literally in the public domain for 20 years. A C…

You think an ordinary person's expectation is that It's A Wonderful Life is public domain? I think the opposite thing is true, and that most Americans generally assume that any major motion picture or television show is copyrighted no matter when it was produced.

> I think the opposite thing is true, and that most Americans generally assume that any major motion picture or television show is copyrighted no matter when it was produced.

You're probably right for everything produced since the second World War, but I doubt people think that e.g. Triumph of the Will is under copyright. I think people have a vague notion of "historical" vs. "contemporary" that starts right around the end of WWII.

Re: Netflix, HBO and Cable Giants Are Coming for Password Sharers

#280

Post by sjy »

awinder wrote: post #144
perennate wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Another issue: they all want you to have proprietary non-free DRM software in your web browser that is a big pain to install. None of these services "just work" like you'd expect, and users have to spend a lot of time configuring their browser for services like Amazon Prime Video and Netflix. And in the end all that configuration work just ends up making your browser much less secure with code from untrusted sources…

This is like, one of my top reasons for thinking there's undisputed superiority (FOR THIS USECASE) in Apple's platform. They own the full stack, so there's nothing to install and it does work exactly like you'd expect it to. Yes yes you have to then own their devices and I know not everyone is in love with that but if you want to consume content, that you pay for, and not fight against the tech you're paying for, it'…

I suppose that addresses the grandparent’s concerns about ease of use, but it makes the problem of running opaque proprietary software controlled by the platform operator even worse.
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