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Soli

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Re: Soli

#271

Post by angleofrepose »

jasonhong wrote: post #119

I recently showed some videos of Soli in the HCI class I teach. Students immediately hit upon the two major issues I wanted to discuss (I was pretty proud!). The first is learnability. A big problem with gestures is that there is no clear affordance as to what kinds of gestures you can do, or any clear feedback. For feedback, one could couple Soli's input with a visual display, but at that point, it's not clear if th…

> A big problem with gestures is that there is no clear affordance as to what kinds of gestures you can do, or any clear feedback > ...learnability

Do you have any examples of well structured learnable systems? I have struggled to find much of anything in this space, yet every technology release I see wants for it.

Here are my two examples, I have no others off the top of my mind. I am more impressed with the vim example.

1. `vim-pandoc-syntax` has a set of documents exampling the feature-set of markdown. These documents are the system they document. Here is one file in a directory of 10 such documents.

https://github.com/vim-pandoc/vim-pandoc-syntax/blob/master/...

2. The KDE shortcuts manager, which lets you see what's bound and bind new things:

https://docs.kde.org/trunk5/en/applications/fundamentals/sho...

I have yet to hear a good response to this question.

I have a Pixel 3 and I want a manual for the device, it appears one does not exist. Nor does documentation. My headphones which came in the box don't resume the most recent media player when I tap the middle button, I called support and over the course of an hour they found they have the same issue. Before my call the people I spoke to said I was wrong and didn't know this issue existed, aftewards they had no advice for me other than to give up. My issue persists.

Re: Soli

#272

Post by spectramax »

jacobolus wrote: post #265
spectramax wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I totally disagree based on experience with using a CAD software for many years. A space mouse isn’t a trackpoint. It is a 6 degrees of freedom device that feels insanely natural once you get used to it. There is a reason why professionals working on 3D software use a Space Mouse - animation studios to Boeing. Everyone got one when you start a new job. You should try one if an opportunity comes up. Honestly, it will…

> I totally disagree Nothing you wrote is in disagreement with anything I wrote, except for the inaccurate assumptions about my past experience and your misunderstanding the main thrust of my comment. I have used several different space mice, and also taken a couple of them completely apart. I understand reasonably well how they work. They have a fixed internal part which is attached to the (slightly movable) outside…

> You completely missed my point. The part that is similar between a space space mouse and a trackpoint or joystick is that all of these essentially measure force on them, with that input converted by software to velocity (or angular velocity). If you let go they move back to a neutral position instead of staying where you put them. They do not measure the direct displacement or rotation of some physical component or body part. This is different than the input of a mouse or a touchscreen or a knob or a slider or a trackball or a scroll wheel or a dial or a stylus, but similar to the input of an analog trigger or pedal or steering wheel.

Yep, I did. I am sorry. I personally cannot stand using a trackpoint for precisely the same reasons as you're describing. Conversely, I tremendously enjoy using a space mouse and you would have to snatch it from my dead cold hands! It is so good, I don't know how to explain.

> This is a non sequitur. But to answer you, I am perfectly happy to flip physical pages on a book for 5 hours straight, without my fingers ever getting tired.

As compared to PageUp/PageDown? Which one do you think would make you less tired?

Re: Soli

#273

Post by crummy »

modernerd wrote: post #234
warrenmiller wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Watch the keynote for more information on accidental gestures. They cater for it

There's a little on accidental input detection in this short video too: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QS8SW-ouM5w

Off topic but does it seem like this link deliberately doesn't load any of the Youtube UI details, just leaving in grey hints? I thought the rest hadn't loaded but it's kind of a nice experience.

It looks like this on my end: https://imgur.com/F65dvgX

Re: Soli

#274

Post by Judgmentality »

cushychicken wrote: post #206
0xffff2 wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you expand on the result of said innovation? Where would I see Kinect driven innovation in everyday life?

Much of that technology was improved and miniaturized, and incorporated into the Apple Face ID bar at the top of the iPhone X.

Personally I feel FaceID is a step backwards from fingerprint readers. It doesn't work as often for me (facial hair, hat, lighting, hoodie, and sometimes it's just finnicky) and there are privacy concerns. The fingerprint reader isn't perfect, but for me it was better. I can touch it while pulling the phone out of my pocket and it's unlocked when I open it.

I'm frustrated with Google's choice to copy Apple and remove this feature from the Pixel 4. It's literally the only reason I'm not buying one.

Re: Soli

#275

Post by aaron695 »

I go to the digital world for abstract.

Why the fuck do I want real world interactions within the digital one? To slow me down?

If I want to move my hands I'll go play a game of sports in the fresh air.

Re: Soli

#277

Post by pazimzadeh »

jasonhong wrote: post #119

I recently showed some videos of Soli in the HCI class I teach. Students immediately hit upon the two major issues I wanted to discuss (I was pretty proud!). The first is learnability. A big problem with gestures is that there is no clear affordance as to what kinds of gestures you can do, or any clear feedback. For feedback, one could couple Soli's input with a visual display, but at that point, it's not clear if th…

Have a squeeze controlled trigger for input mode in your non-dominant hand?

Re: Soli

#278

Post by jacobolus »

spectramax wrote: post #272
jacobolus wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I totally disagree Nothing you wrote is in disagreement with anything I wrote, except for the inaccurate assumptions about my past experience and your misunderstanding the main thrust of my comment. I have used several different space mice, and also taken a couple of them completely apart. I understand reasonably well how they work. They have a fixed internal part which is attached to the (slightly movable) outside…

> You completely missed my point. The part that is similar between a space space mouse and a trackpoint or joystick is that all of these essentially measure force on them, with that input converted by software to velocity (or angular velocity). If you let go they move back to a neutral position instead of staying where you put them. They do not measure the direct displacement or rotation of some physical component or…

The physical book is a lot easier to carry to different kinds of body positions on varying furniture, walk around with, etc.

I suppose a tap on the iPad screen is probably technically the least effort, but I don’t find flipping book pages to be a hardship, and being able to write in the book margins, organize books on the shelf, etc. is nice. YMMV.

The most stressful aspect of using a typical workstation computer to read a long document is probably sitting in a typical office chair. You could compensate for that with a standing desk, but the book is still nicer IMO.

> It is so good, I don't know how to explain.

This is mostly because a 2D mouse + keyboard is quite a poor tool for navigating in 3 dimensions. A multitouch screen could conceivably be decent with a well-designed interface, but the common ones aren’t great.

Re: Soli

#279

Post by roywiggins »

CobrastanJorji wrote: post #252
dmd wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, but Trillian did that on purpose specifically to turn off the radio.

Perhaps the computer is smart enough to determine intent. To paraphrase Marvin, "Here I am with a brain the size of a planet and they ask me to determine whether you were gesturing at me on purpose."

Sirius Cybernetics clearly had some ideas along those lines, but the results were lacking:

"He had found a Nutri-Matic machine which had provided him with a plastic cup filled with a liquid that was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea. The way it functioned was very interesting. When the Drink button was pressed it made an instant but highly detailed examination of the subject's taste buds, a spectroscopic examination of the subject's metabolism and then sent tiny experimental signals down the neural pathways to the taste centers of the subject's brain to see what was likely to go down well. However, no one knew quite why it did this because it invariably delivered a cupful of liquid that was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea."

Re: Soli

#280

Post by asdfasgasdgasdg »

codetrotter wrote: post #232
jasonhong wrote: post #119

I recently showed some videos of Soli in the HCI class I teach. Students immediately hit upon the two major issues I wanted to discuss (I was pretty proud!). The first is learnability. A big problem with gestures is that there is no clear affordance as to what kinds of gestures you can do, or any clear feedback. For feedback, one could couple Soli's input with a visual display, but at that point, it's not clear if th…

> A big problem with gestures is that there is no clear affordance as to what kinds of gestures you can do, or any clear feedback. For feedback, one could couple Soli's input with a visual display, but at that point, it's not clear if there is a big advantage over a touchscreen, unless the display is really small. For the Google Pixel 4 that they are using in the video you already have a big display. It can instruct…

Or, depending how smart it is, and its range, it might detect your head attitude and use that as a proxy for attention. The website claims that it can detect a turn toward, a lean, or a look.
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