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How Restaurants Got So Loud

theatlantic.com

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Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#271

Post by war1025 »

err4nt wrote: post #270
war1025 wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is being open costs money. In order to be profitable, you need to bring in more money than the cost of the labor, and that's after you account for cost of the product and the other fixed costs. There is also the trouble that most of the people who will be around at close of business likely came in an hour or two earlier, so you are essentially paying someone to monitor the cafe without bringing in any new…

I would think the morning before-work rush would be the best time to capture money as a coffee shop, same with the after work time. They are basically only open while working people are away from the neighbourhood and have their doors shut when the biggest rushes of people would be there. And it's not just them, I see a lot of local businesses in this area struggling, but the problem is they aren't open to take my mo…

The coffee shop closest to my house has the same problem. The only times they are open are while I'm at work. They opened right about the time we moved (a little over a year ago), and we were excited to have a play we could go close by. But they are never open when it would be convenient for us.

The dumbest thing in my mind is that they are open for like 4 hours on Saturday (7am - 11am).

I think the problem with that particular coffee shop though is that they lady who owns it also runs a catering / event hosting business, so the needs of the coffee shop come last.

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#272

Post by jlokier »

JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #232
jlokier wrote: post #108

There's an ice cream and bagel place in town. In the late evening it's consistently packed with people on their laptops or reading books. One day I noticed the music was much louder than usual, and asked the staff to turn it down. I figured it was a mistake because it was normally much quieter. They told me this was the new company policy. To set the music uncomfortably loud to make people leave, after finishing thei…

Why are you using an ice cream and bagel place as a library or home?

TBH your question strikes me as having a trolling tone. But I'll answer in good faith anyway. I'm pretty sure most people here understand why people like going to communal places to sit, enjoy snacks and drinks, and read or work quietly.

The question is, why is everyone else using it as a library with snacks. As I said, it's always packed in the late evenings.

The neighbouring coffee shops are also packed until midnight.

Here are some ideas:

- Why not, it's nice to do.

- Some of us are happy to pay for it.

- Lots of people want an evening place, aka "third space", but don't care for bars, alcohol and shouting. They want to quietly sit and read late at night, socially around other people, with some talking some of the time, but not constantly.

- For many, home is not suitable for working, studying or relaxing. It depends a lot on the home.

- It helps to be around other people to focus and relax, and it's nice to have an ice cream and/or bagel and/or drink while doing it.

- There's no library nearby.

- There's a great library further away, but it's shut in the evenings. (Our libraries are often packed with people. Until they close, then everyone has to find somewhere else.)

- If you enjoy reading/writing around strangers being a bit fun and lively, you won't get that in a library. But a bar is too much. Maybe it doesn't work for you, but for me and many others, the buzz from people just being happy in the vicinity is quite helpful.

- No affordable co-working spaces. The few co-working spaces are either rent-per-month (too expensive if you don't use them a lot), or closed in the evening to daily renters. Anyway, the day rate (~$20/day) is too much if you're only out for a couple of hours, and don't have good money (most people I see around are not working in IT, btw).

- Not enough friendly communal spaces. (Btw, I've helped run one of these. It was really hard work!)

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#273

Post by erdo »

mnw21cam wrote: post #62
erdo wrote: post #3

This is a pet hate of mine - glad to see it's not just me getting older. A restaurant round the corner from me has acoustic foam on the under-side of all the hard wood chairs and tables, and that helps a little. As soon as I find a bar that's decided to carpet its ceiling, it's going to be my new favourite hang (I understand why places don't want carpet on the floor. Apart from anything else, it's hard to keep clean)

The Met Office in the UK has a canteen, and at one point, they decided that it was too noisy. Their solution was to make a load of person-sized wool "clouds", and hang them from the ceiling. They look cool, and they absorb noise. A couple of months ago, I went to a conference in San Diego, and went to a restaurant in the evening with colleagues. We could hardly hear the person next to us shouting. I left as soon as I…

That reminds me of the Royal Albert Hall in London - don't know if you've been, but they have things that look like giant mints hanging from the ceiling. (I assume it's to break up any echo from the bowl shaped ceiling)

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#274

Post by Mikeb85 »

johnvanommen wrote: post #230
Mikeb85 wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Operating a restaurant is expensive. Rent is by the square foot, so you taking up a certain amount of space with your 1 tea per hour (max 2 teas?) won't pay their bills.

I managed restaurants for a few years. One consistent mistake that I saw, was that restaurant owners would rent more space than they needed. I think the owners over-estimated how popular things were going to be. Because of this, one of the easiest ways to improve your odds of success, when you own a restaurant, is to lease LESS space than you need. Basically there's a lot of good reasons to make your customers wait i…

Absolutely. At the end of the day, you need to maximize dollars per square foot (or seat). Better to do 3 turns of 25 covers than to do 1 turn of 75 covers.

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#275

Post by Mikeb85 »

NotAnEconomist wrote: post #190
decebalus1 wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It probably won't be the most popular opinion but I'm siding with the business for this one. I never got people who use cafe bars, delis, etc.. as personal offices. I personally can't get 'in the zone' in such a public place where: - I need to buy/consume something every X minutes - have to overhear irrelevant stupid/mundane conversations - people have a habit of bringing their dogs everywhere now and I'm not even go…

> I never got this working from a coffee shop thing. This is an old tradition. Cafes, bars, tea houses, etc have served as social hubs and placed to read or work on documents (now computers) for literally thousands of years, everywhere on the planet. There's simply a social need for a space like that, because it's a more efficient usage of space to have people work on a revolving basis in a shared space than everyone…

Actually the thing which kills this model nowadays is the obscene cost of real estate and the rentier class. Coffee shops simply can't be profitable as workspaces any more.

You still can see coffee spots as social places in developing countries.

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#278

Post by jlokier »

8note wrote: post #267
jlokier wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know if it truly protects them from damage overall. That would take science. See "complicated" below :) But the basic answer to your question is, no, it doesn't double the sound energy. To the extent the headphones are successful at creating an inverse sound to cancel incoming sound, that will reduce the sound energy reaching the inner ears. The sound and its "mirror" don't add up to increase energy, rather,…

won't that depend on how well synced the waves are? if you get the wrong phase, you're doubling the amplitude

If you get the wrong phase, you can hear it - it's louder.

So, if it's quieter, you're ok.

If the device makes the outside world louder, then yes, you might want to turn it off. (This actually happens on my headphones when taking a call.)

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#279

Post by [deleted] »

hammock wrote: post #172
erikpukinskis wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I always thought it was because noise cancelling can only block repeated waves (like the sound of an engine whirring) but conversation is constant changing sound so it can’t be blocked.

Much easier to match pace with a wave with long wavelength than one with short

[deleted]

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#280

Post by 4ad »

fredley wrote: post #5

One thing that's becoming near-impossible is finding places to drink (as in pubs or bars) without piped music. This contributes significantly to noise. It's done of course so that we shout ourselves hoarse trying to have a conversation, so we buy more drinks to lubricate our throat, but even formerly quiet pubs near me have started doing it.

A few years back, here in Vienna bars didn't turn on TVs for a whole year (there was a notice on the TVs about how they can't turn them on for some reason, and to complain to $WHOEVER, not sure of the details). It was magnificent.

Even better, one pub didn't have music at all. It was the best pub in town, and that's not just my opinion because it was one of the busiest pubs.

I wish it were like that again.

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