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Juicero Is Shutting Down

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Re: Juicero Is Shutting Down

#271

Post by cocktailpeanuts »

yahna wrote: post #231
_sentient wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The answer to this is fairly straightforward: VCs don't actually expect (or need) every investment to be successful, they just need it to have the potential to be huge if everything works out. Laypeople always seem shocked when a VC-funded company implodes. We should actually be surprised if we didn't see routine flame-outs, as that would mean VCs aren't taking on appropriate quantities of risk for the asset class. A…

It's not that a VC company failed, it's that the entire idea looks completely ridiculous from the start.

The problem is a lot of disruptive businesses initially looked "completely ridiculous from the start".

VCs are not idiots, they are probably much more humble than what ordinary people think they are, because any active VC--especially if they're successful--would have run into at least several cases where they passed on a company because they "looked stupid", just to find out that they went on to become wildly successful.

Once you go through this routine several times, you generally learn to appreciate and not immediately discount seemingly stupid ideas. This happens not just to VCs but overall if you live in Silicon Valley.

Since ideas alone aren't enough, the only good measure in my experience is looking at the person who's working on it. And here lies a lot of mistakes VCs make, they just look at some guy who was successful in the past and just think it's safe to bet on them.

To be clear, I also think Juicero was a stupid idea, and I think it was stupid of them to waste so much money upfront instead of starting scrappy, but my point is that there is no such thing as an "absolutely stupid idea". Ideas are contextual.

Re: Juicero Is Shutting Down

#272

Post by GuiA »

jjawssd wrote: post #176
jjawssd wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agafia is a hermit surviving in the Russian wilderness for 70 years. I recommend the RT report on her because they do not try to force a conclusion to the contact. She is afraid of barcodes even though she barely has any contact with other people. During the last world war humans were assigned serial numbers for efficient tracking and resource allocation and extermination. Agafia and her people ran away from several…

Why am I being down-voted?

HN has a hivemind of its own, and many completely sensible posts get downvoted. Don't get too upset about it.

Re: Juicero Is Shutting Down

#273

Post by zzleeper »

hannob wrote: post #265
briandear wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is probably because I can go to the store right now and buy pretty great Odwalla stuff that tastes good and is healthy. However, pre-brewed coffee from a bottle isn’t at the same level as fresh coffee. The point is that there are reasonable substitutes for a Juicero, but coffee at home is something people already make but most people don’t care about making their own juice — and if they were aficionados, they woul…

> It is probably because I can go to the store right now and buy pretty great Odwalla stuff that tastes good and is healthy. Contrary to popular belief none of that stuff is healthy. It doesn't matter whether it comes from a juicero or from a bottle, it just all contains far too much sugar.

For some reason, people seem to think that eating 40 grams of apple sugar is healthier than eating "sugar cane sugar" or "corn sugar".

IMHO, of you take an apple and extract the fiber and water, you shouldn't be calling that fruit any more.

Re: Juicero Is Shutting Down

#274

Post by kuschku »

JimDabell wrote: post #141
trendia wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I love how Bolt.io tore down a pair of Beats headphones and came to the opposite conclusion -- that they were a ripoff and that the components inside in no way justified the pricetag. But, take a look at the quality of the internals of Juicero vs. Beats headphones and realize that one of the companies is worth $1.5B while the other is shutting down.

That "Beats" teardown was with a counterfeit pair of headphones. Even so, I don't think a large difference between the BOM and the price the consumer pays is necessarily a ripoff. There's more to a product than simply how much it costs to manufacture.

> Even so, I don't think a large difference between the BOM and the price the consumer pays is necessarily a ripoff.

Actually, in some jurisdictions, if that difference goes over 12.5% of the paid price, and the customer is not specifically informed about this (and about potential cheaper competitors), the contract is not valid.

Re: Juicero Is Shutting Down

#277

Post by dragonwriter »

marcosdumay wrote: post #263
dzhiurgis wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Juice is not addictive as caffeine, perhaps that’s why.

- A capsule coffee machine is way cheaper than an expresso machine. - Expressos are minimally hard to make correctly, and those capsules are above even the quality of some coffee shops. - There is a big movement of gourmet coffee that favors high priced drinks with the correct marketing (not perfectly correlated with quality). None of those seem to apply to Juicero. They may have aimed at the last point, but I don't…

> A capsule coffee machine is way cheaper than an expresso machine.

The cheaper capsule machines are about the same price as the cheaper non-capsule espresso machines.

It's true that the high end of espresso machines goes well above the high end of capsule machines, but that doesn't seem particularly relevant.

Re: Juicero Is Shutting Down

#278

Post by wpietri »

johnhenry wrote: post #205

I simply do not understand the mindset of silicon valley investors. I used to think that perhaps they had some edge that helped them to get behind successful companies, but looking at this -- how much money they raised and from whom -- I think that there are just a bunch of people who have so much money that they can afford to risk throwing it away on something that will not likely succeed. Can someone watch the vide…

The thing that troubles me is not that people tried a dumb idea. It's that they spend $120m trying a dumb idea.

That is 100 seed rounds that never happened. Could we have learned the lessons here for less?

I'm gueessing yes; the ridiculously over-engineered [1] juice press is a good sign that efficient use of capital was just not a priority.

[1] https://blog.bolt.io/heres-why-juicero-s-press-is-so-expensi...

Re: Juicero Is Shutting Down

#279

Post by twblalock »

Laforet wrote: post #247
_jtrig wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could say that same about Soylent as it's simply a Pediasure/Ensure marketed towards hipster 20-somethings. People love drawing the conclusion that superior marketing/design equates to better products. Often times, if you can make a consumer happy with the experience, they don't care if they're overpaying for a terrible product. The problem with Juicero is that their user experience laid bare how futile and ridic…

>The problem with Juicero is that their user experience laid bare how futile and ridiculous their product was by having consumers manufacture the product themselves. Blue Apron and every other meal kit delivery business sits on the other end of the same road, yet they seem to be doing okay and without the same level of ridicule. I wonder whether Juicero could have avoided this outcome had they mailed their customers…

I expect a lot of failures and consolidation in the meal kit business soon, especially if Amazon starts delivering Whole Foods products.

Re: Juicero Is Shutting Down

#280

Post by Powerofmene »

eropple wrote: post #18
Powerofmene wrote: post #12

It is a shame that Juicero could not develop a product with a lower price point that could reach a much broader marketplace. With the initial price point they should have clearly seen that their customer pool was going to be smaller than that of a lower cost product. It seems that they did not have enough time and money to right their ship. It is sad to see a dream die even if you don't agree with the product or busi…

I think it's more a shame that they didn't actually make a product anyone needed . Just remember that this was a thing actually said about real life humans who can walk and talk and dress themselves: > One of the investors said they were frustrated with how the company didn’t deliver on the original pitch and that their venture firm wouldn’t have met with Evans if he were hawking bags of juice that didn’t require hig…

I agree they should have done what they said they would do and should have talked to potential customers before making something that was not wanted or needed. And I do not dispute what you say about the product not being needed. I also agree that the money would have been better used on other companies but personally I think that the employees are the losers here (as are the investors). If the employees truly believed in their product then the employees have worked on something that has gone nowhere. All their work and effort is gone. That cannot be regained. These people are out of work. And for that reason, it is sad.
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