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MIT economist believes U.S. is shifting to be more similar to developing nations

theintellectualist.co

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Re: MIT economist believes U.S. is shifting to be more similar to developing nations

#271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

3rd world means non-NATO aligned states (or communist aligned states). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_World

Yes, through the original conception But today it mostly means "developing countries" (which is actually an euphemism for "stuck in underdevelopment")

"Developing countries" is a much better term. "Third world" is vague, outdated, and means something completely different.

Not that the US is a developing country; it was developed, and is currently degenerating. It's still very rich, though. So instead of trying to catch this in a single ill-fitting word, perhaps it would be better to simply discuss the actual issues: the rise of poverty, lack of social mobility, crumbling infrastructure, etc.

Re: MIT economist believes U.S. is shifting to be more similar to developing nations

#272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it also contained a democratic system (first past the post/two party system) that is mathematically bound to breed divisiveness. It doesn't have anything about parties in it at all, and leaves it up to the states to decide how to choose their electors. If California or any other state wanted a different system, it could decide to use ranked choice voting right now just like Maine chose last election.

That could make a difference in the House, but not in the Senate.

I think it could be reasonable to have system where the House represents the people (making proportional representation necessary) while the Senate represents the states. As long as the role of the Senate is sufficiently limited and not the core of the legislative process, that could be very reasonable. But it's vital that the people are more important than the states.

For example, the House could decide on the laws, with the Senate only deciding whether this is an issue that belongs on the federal level at all. And maybe double checking whether the law is constitutional and in line with existing treaties.

If they do the same thing, it makes no sense to have them both.

Re: MIT economist believes U.S. is shifting to be more similar to developing nations

#273

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is completely false.

I may have mistaken electricity or running water for just running water, and any numbers are sketchy as they don't have a lot of trust in the federal government, but life in the SD reservations is fucked up. Lack of utilities, 25% of children are born with fetal alcohol syndrome, people are dying from packs of wild dogs, and ~90% unemployment. You could argue it isn't third world conditions, but a slow burning genoci…

Thanks for admitting you were lying, and now you are moving the goalposts from you original claim (which also appears to be untrue).

Re: MIT economist believes U.S. is shifting to be more similar to developing nations

#274
post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, ours is, but not all republics are democracies. Republic just means we don't have a monarchy and leaders are chosen by some other means. It doesn't mean that means is a democracy.

No, it's a republic because it has a constitution that sets out the rules for what the government is and is not allowed to do. Democracies give the people absolute rule, whereas the constitution denies a majority from enacting certain laws that violate the constitution.

Having a constitution just makes a country "constitutional", it doesn't make it a republic. You're conflating being constitutional with being a republic, they are different things; we are both of those things, but they are unrelated things. We are a republic because we don't have a monarchy, that's all it means. Our minority rights are protected because we're a constitutional government who has protections for those things; that has nothing to do with our being a republic.

Re: MIT economist believes U.S. is shifting to be more similar to developing nations

#275
post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> First of all, it is a republic and not a democracy. That's like saying it's a dog not an animal; our republic is also a democracy, they are not mutually exclusive terms so please stop saying this nonsense.

No, we have a republic. Fundamentally different animal. In a democracy, the public could vote to do something that would be considered wrong such as stripping voting rights from everyone who likes country music. And with majority rule, that would pass and become law of the land. In a republic like ours, the constitution governs what can and cannot be enacted by the majority. Since such an act would take away guarante…

> No, we have a republic. Fundamentally different animal.

No it's not, and it's really sad and tiring such a simple concept escapes so many people. Please take a course in government and learn the difference between these things you're conflating. Republics don't have to have constitutions and constitutional governments aren't necessarily republics. Republics can be democracies or not, ours is, not all are.

Our minority rights are protected because we're a constitutional government who has protections for those things; that has nothing to do with our being a republic.

Re: MIT economist believes U.S. is shifting to be more similar to developing nations

#276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Federal Outlays: ~$3.8T Federal Defense: ~$0.7T

Heres a graph of federal revenues -- https://media.nationalpriorities.org/uploads/revenue_pie%2C_... And here's a graph of federal spending -- https://media.nationalpriorities.org/uploads/total_spending_... In theory the payroll taxes from the first picture completely cover the spending on social security/unemployment insurance -- (and this is currently the case) -- so including that category in the total federal out…

> argue for reducing tax expenditures

Tax deductions are not a part of the $3.8T. If you were to "cut" "tax expenditures" with no change to the tax rate it would cause federal receipts to increase. If made revenue neutral by a corresponding reduction in the tax rate, federal spending would remain at $3.8T, all that would change is the distribution of the same total federal tax burden.

> In theory the payroll taxes from the first picture completely cover the spending on social security/unemployment insurance

They in fact more than cover social security, which is part of the problem. We have a highly regressive payroll tax -- janitors pay >15% while Warren Buffet pays > including that category in the total federal outlays is a little disingenuous when making an argument about too much federal spending/taxation if you don't intend to cut that source of federal spending/taxation ...

Eliminating payroll taxes is what we should do. Pay for social security from the general fund and let rich people and corporations pay their share.

And there is no inherent reason benefits would have to be cut to remove them from federal jurisdiction. Hand the entire program over to the states. It changes who is responsible for the problem, which allows it to be solved, because each state can make a rational local choice between different local needs.

Then you don't have inefficient decisions as a result of federal politics. Right now states like California are falling apart because they have a high cost of living, even though federal tax rates take no mind of that. Making $70,000 in California produces the same standard of living as making $35,000 in many other states, but causes the person in California to pay a higher federal tax rate and receive fewer federal benefits. The state then has to suffer or cover the benefits deficit while its people have less discretionary income for the state to tax, because a higher percentage of it goes to the feds which is then spent on other states.

That sort of interstate theft is inherent in large central governments. The people of California pay the brunt of the burden, but they aren't a majority of the federal legislature, so they can't stop it. The money goes primarily to cronies and large corporations (especially with federal healthcare spending), but there is a secondary benefit for people in low cost of living states who get subsidized by people in higher cost of living states, which gives it the votes to pass at the federal level and creates all of this waste. Wasteful and expensive programs are easy to pass because losing half the money to corruption is no impediment to passage when it was some other state's money to begin with.

> and then way down there at the bottom, the entire rest of the federal budget which is typically vilified as "government waste"

The waste isn't the NIH budget or NASA, it's in the structure of all federal spending. Social programs belong at the state and local level. Even the defense budget should be more local -- let the state-level national guard be a larger percentage of the military.

People malign the US healthcare system, but the root of the problem is that we have federal heathcare policy. It would be like trying to have a unified healthcare system for the whole EU, regardless of the different cost of procedures, income levels, cost of living or anything else between countries. It's not that Italy can't have a functioning healthcare system, it just needs different rules from the German one. California needs different rules from Alabama.

If you try to build one system that works for everybody, you end up with an inefficient bureaucratic mess that doesn't work for anybody.

Spain decentralized the healthcare system even within their state with positive results, indicating that the optimal scale for healthcare may even be at the county level.

Re: MIT economist believes U.S. is shifting to be more similar to developing nations

#277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As an asside North Korea does ship workers abroad to work as slave laborers.

Partially that scheme seems to be an attempt to engage DPRK in some kind of dialog to prevent an unstable dictatorship with nuclear weapons and a lot of artillery that can reach Seoul from causing bad damage. But given that utilising or even tolerating slave labourers on the ground in democratic nations is such a shameful thing, it might be better to actually let DPRK be completely isolated from global economy and no…

iirc a bulk of these workers find themselves in Russia or China so hardly on democratic lands.

If you know of other instances of this that'd be a fascinating topic to read up on.

Re: MIT economist believes U.S. is shifting to be more similar to developing nations

#278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I may have mistaken electricity or running water for just running water, and any numbers are sketchy as they don't have a lot of trust in the federal government, but life in the SD reservations is fucked up. Lack of utilities, 25% of children are born with fetal alcohol syndrome, people are dying from packs of wild dogs, and ~90% unemployment. You could argue it isn't third world conditions, but a slow burning genoci…

Thanks for admitting you were lying, and now you are moving the goalposts from you original claim (which also appears to be untrue).

Wasn't lying, misread an article. And I have no idea how you think it looks untrue. Their situation is quite similar to a third world country, you're free to come and see for yourself.

Re: MIT economist believes U.S. is shifting to be more similar to developing nations

#279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You can't mandate factual reporting and still call it a free press as those enforcing the "fact" standards now control the press. You seem to think that you can't lie with facts, but it's quite easy, watch fox news they do it all day long They're often quite non-factual actually. And you can't call it "press" unless it's factual, free or not. You can't just ignore one factor in favour of the other. Furthermore, you…

I sympathize with your goal, but you can't legally enforce journalistic ethics. And yes of course Fox is often non-factual, my point was one can be misleading with nothing but the truth and they demonstrate that constantly, stopping them from lying isn't going to stop them from misleading their audience. The solution to bad speech isn't to ban it, it's just for others to put out better news. However, people don't see…

> And yes of course Fox is often non-factual, my point was one can be misleading with nothing but the truth and they demonstrate that constantly, stopping them from lying isn't going to stop them from misleading their audience.

Solving a problem doesn't always mean requiring something bullet-proof. Good enough can be enough. It won't stop some people from misleading with the truth, but a lot more people will be better informed than they are now, which is an important step.

> However, people don't seek out real news, they seek out confirmation of their existing beliefs so no amount of fair and accurate fact based reporting is going to change that, they'll still seek out whatever organization offers them confirmation of their biases whether it's called news or not.

Exactly, which is why factual standards are important to classify as proper journalism. They can still seek out their confirmation, but it will be more difficult to find it, and more difficult to convince others of their distorted realities.

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