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Show HN: Hire an Oldster

tryoldster.com

271–280 of 308 posts

Re: Show HN: Hire an Oldster

#271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

doesn't really matter. as I just wrote, my only point is that the supply at that price is greater than 0 - that some people will do it. who are in their twenties. you won't find someone even over thirty willing to do it though. it's a descriptive statement.

Are you sure the people that will do it are the ones you want to be doing it (if you are paying?). If they are so vastly underestimating their market value, perhaps it's because they are actually vastly overestimating their ability.

I have to agree with the perhaps inappropriately named logicallee. And I'd go further - it's not just a matter of age, nor (as others in this thread have said) of inability or stupidity, if someone works for a salary under market value. I am far from the best at my job in the world, but I'm ok, and for the longest time as a freelancer I charged way under the market (in fact I suspect I still do, though not so egregiously). This was - I think - not because I "overestimated my ability" or anything like that. I was simply not a business-minded person. I was afraid to ask for more. I earned enough to live from, and the rest seemed somehow distasteful to me. I'm not saying this is the ideal, just a fact. And if I have these characteristics, perhaps others do too.

Re: Show HN: Hire an Oldster

#272
post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A two week crunch time every 6 months is OK, maybe even beneficial Being overworked nearly 10% of the time is not "OK"

Depends how often you're underworked.

I think I dislike underworking as much as overworking.

Re: Show HN: Hire an Oldster

#273
post #171

I'm not old, 32, but this problem worries me. My plan for addressing the "Must keep up with latest tech" problem is to CREATE the latest technology. My hope if I create enough of it that in 15 years I'll be that old guy who created tech X or Y and nobody is going to bother wondering if I can keep up. Will this plan work? Who knows. Best way to predict the future is create it right?

My plan for addressing the "Must keep up with latest tech" problem is to CREATE the latest technology

This kind of thinking is why there are a hundred Javascript frameworks and more being made all the time, thus creating the problem you're trying to solve by joining in...

Re: Show HN: Hire an Oldster

#275

As an oldster - two things that I really wish my younger self would have intimately realized. 1) As a software person your are employed to Solve Business Problems - NOT to write code, NOT to write tests, NOT to hack on platforms, NOT to be Agile. Solve the problem (or add the feature) - never lose sight of this. The value you bring is directly related to this. 2) People outside software development don't give a flyin…

I've worked for a number of companies that did pay to "be agile". It was sort of a cargo cult thing sold by middle management to upper management or upper management to other upper management.

Delivery of working software is supposed to trump everything else in theory, but in practice it often doesn't.

Re: Show HN: Hire an Oldster

#276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All right. I'll be honest, I forgot what thread we were on, I was just in awe at all of the sites you run. My next thought was, "man, I wish I could use some guy like him, but he is just too expensive." One thing is for sure: there are definitely, 100%, no-questions about it, over 1 people who can be reached and who, at least for a few months, would take over 15,000 pages and 154+ sites. (An early 20s hacker). For un…

Once you find the person stupid enough to accept crap pay for doing something that earns you tons of profit - are you sure you found a person smart enough to do what you need?

There is a big difference between "how much value you create" and the percentage of that that you can capture for yourself.

In the non-labor market airlines a great example of this. They create tremendous value for their customers (fast long distance transportation), but the industry as a whole is not very profitable.

Same for employment. Many (hopefully most) employees generate more value than their salaries, but that does not mean they can negotiate for that value to be added to their salary. If there is someone else with similar capabilities willing to do the job at $x, then negotiating pay above $x will be difficult.

Re: Show HN: Hire an Oldster

#277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think you're wrong , per se, but barring that I'm really unclear on what point you're trying to make.

my only point is that the supply at that price is greater than 0 - that some people will do it. who are in their twenties. you won't find someone even over thirty willing to do it though. it's a descriptive statement.

Seems to me that the number of retired engineers working as Wal-Mart greeters is actually more than one, and has been for a while.

Re: Show HN: Hire an Oldster

#278
post #42

If you take a survey of hiring managers they will point to three primary reasons that candidates 40 - 60 have a harder time finding jobs: 1) They are typically more expensive than "market" for the same role a younger person can fulfill at acceptable tradeoff of competency - higher salaries, higher related costs like healthcare for a family, expectations around retirement programs, etc. 2) They are less flexible - the…

I agree with your points 1 and 2. Not sure what you mean by your last paragraph, though. Train who to do what? Old people to stop expecting to have money after retiring? Managers to stop letting their monkey brains harm their company's profitability by having people work 60-hour weeks? Something else?

Re: Show HN: Hire an Oldster

#279
post #57
post #42

If you take a survey of hiring managers they will point to three primary reasons that candidates 40 - 60 have a harder time finding jobs: 1) They are typically more expensive than "market" for the same role a younger person can fulfill at acceptable tradeoff of competency - higher salaries, higher related costs like healthcare for a family, expectations around retirement programs, etc. 2) They are less flexible - the…

I look at the skillset between when I was 25 and now (30) and it's astounding. I can't imagine what the difference between 50 and 25 will be. If you're hiring 40-60 year olds you cannot simply hire a 25 year old and get an "acceptable tradeoff of competency" unless you didn't need anything close to that competency in the first place. Also if you're 50 and are relying on a new job's retirement program you're probably…

There are fundamentally two kinds of experienced people: Those with n years of experience, and those with m years of experience n/m times (where n >> m). Part of the only-somewhat-mythical recently-lost middle class compact was that you you train to do something, then work the rest of your life doing that. The former kind, the people who trained as electrical engineers in the 70s (because computer science wasn't invented then), then kept their skills up to date, will have very little trouble finding interesting and well-paid things to work on. The people who still think in terms of mainframes and consider tab-completion uncomfortable magic[1] won't. When, on top of that, they subscribe to the other part of said middle class compact, that your salary is supposed to keep going up (above inflation), then you have a recipe for disappointment.

Is there embarrassing ageism in tech? Undoubtedly. Does ageism explain all of why elder techies on average have trouble finding employment in 'new tech'? I strongly doubt it.

1: The number of ostensibly highly experienced Unix (retrained on Linux) system admins that I have personally, not even exaggerating, promise, taught to use tab completion in Bash in this decade is depressing.

Re: Show HN: Hire an Oldster

#280
post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It is absolutely ageist to assume that a 50 yr old is going to have more trouble staying current than a 30 yr old. I don't know if I agree with that. When I was 25, I was all over every new technology that came out. I was the expert in my group. I'm now pushing 50. The latest tech isn't nearly as interesting. And honestly, I'm getting tired of chasing it. My energy level has dropped a bit. Physically I'm not in as…

I think every 50 year old is different. A fifty year old who did some regular exercise, is different than a guy who spent the last thirty years sitting at a desk? When I was younger, I thought most people over 30 were basically worthless. As I've aged, I changed that up a bit. Young and old have their place. When I was in my twenties, and thirties; you couldn't pay me to sit in front of a computer--literally. What wa…

Your writing style is really enjoyable to read.
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