Telegram gains 1M users after Whatsapp ban • Hacker News Board

Re: Telegram gains 1M users after Whatsapp ban

#271

Post by caskance » Fri, Dec 18, 2015, 3:31 PM UTC

ethbro wrote: post #258

caskance wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You've described a problem privacy only exacerbates. Complete enforcement is the best way to get bad laws adjusted or removed. Privacy makes that harder.

Disagree. Money always buys privacy / leniency. In a completely transparent system, you'll still have bad or questionable laws. You'll just have them only applied to people who can't buy their way out. Unless complete transparency also solves the corruption problem. ;)

Historically, true. But we are rapidly approaching the point where there will be no privacy available to buy.

Re: Telegram gains 1M users after Whatsapp ban

#272

Post by Karunamon » Fri, Dec 18, 2015, 4:47 PM UTC

EGreg wrote: post #263

kawakiole wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> giving random people the chance to control a huge megaphone makes you LESS equal, not more People can choose what to hear. It's not random, It's the complete opposite of random.

When it comes to mass media, they can choose the channel that they listen to from a limited number of platforms. On this channel, they hear something because a few elites made a decision to broadcast it. For example, how many Messengers are there? Apple, FOX, Telegram have a responsibility because of their reach. Anyway you haven't addressed the downsides I posted. All you do is ignore them in favor of the upsides. I…

Roughly 3/4 of Americans have access to the internet[1] (and more than half of them are over 65) as of two years ago, which blows the "limited number of platforms" argument away quite handily. The number of individual outlets you can get your news from is functionally unlimited.

The mass media has a responsibility all right, but not the one you think they do.

[1]: https://www.census.gov/history/pdf/2013computeruse.pdf

Re: Telegram gains 1M users after Whatsapp ban

#273

Post by EGreg » Fri, Dec 18, 2015, 5:51 PM UTC

Karunamon wrote: post #272

EGreg wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When it comes to mass media, they can choose the channel that they listen to from a limited number of platforms. On this channel, they hear something because a few elites made a decision to broadcast it. For example, how many Messengers are there? Apple, FOX, Telegram have a responsibility because of their reach. Anyway you haven't addressed the downsides I posted. All you do is ignore them in favor of the upsides. I…

Roughly 3/4 of Americans have access to the internet[1] (and more than half of them are over 65) as of two years ago, which blows the "limited number of platforms" argument away quite handily. The number of individual outlets you can get your news from is functionally unlimited. The mass media has a responsibility all right, but not the one you think they do. [1]: https://www.census.gov/history/pdf/2013computeruse.pd…

What makes you think that there is an unlimited number of mass media platforms?

And what do you think their responsibility actually is? I thought they had rights to say whatever they want and responsibility is optional...

Re: Telegram gains 1M users after Whatsapp ban

#274

Post by Karunamon » Fri, Dec 18, 2015, 6:00 PM UTC

EGreg wrote: post #273

Karunamon wrote: post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Roughly 3/4 of Americans have access to the internet[1] (and more than half of them are over 65) as of two years ago, which blows the "limited number of platforms" argument away quite handily. The number of individual outlets you can get your news from is functionally unlimited. The mass media has a responsibility all right, but not the one you think they do. [1]: https://www.census.gov/history/pdf/2013computeruse.pd…

What makes you think that there is an unlimited number of mass media platforms? And what do you think their responsibility actually is? I thought they had rights to say whatever they want and responsibility is optional...

Functionally unlimited, not mathematically infinite. No human has the time to meaningfully evaluate all of them.

And I think their responsibility is the conditions under which they were given broadcast licenses in the first place. Something about serving the public good.

Re: Telegram gains 1M users after Whatsapp ban

#275

Post by EGreg » Fri, Dec 18, 2015, 9:58 PM UTC

Karunamon wrote: post #274

EGreg wrote: post #273

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What makes you think that there is an unlimited number of mass media platforms? And what do you think their responsibility actually is? I thought they had rights to say whatever they want and responsibility is optional...

Functionally unlimited, not mathematically infinite. No human has the time to meaningfully evaluate all of them. And I think their responsibility is the conditions under which they were given broadcast licenses in the first place. Something about serving the public good.

So there you go. That's regulation.

Re: Telegram gains 1M users after Whatsapp ban

#276

Post by holografix » Sat, Dec 19, 2015, 11:27 AM UTC

pqdbr wrote: post #65

I'm a judge in Brazil. Even tough I'd pray to not be the one that had to give such an impopular order (affecting more then 100 million Brazilians - WhatsApp is really a hit here), we have laws in this country and we must prosecute criminals. Mark's talk about privacy is, in my opinion, totally misplaced. No right is absolute, and that includes the right to privacy. Criminals, for example, simply don't have it. This i…

"The injunction was sought by a plaintiff before a criminal court in São Paulo state whose identity was kept secret."[1]

So let me get this straight. The president is risking an impeachment, there is renewed discontent with the unprecedented levels of corruption... And some unknown judge, representing an unknown plaintiff, bans a mass communication tool used by 93 million Brazilians daily, by requesting something the people responsible for the tool are capable of producing...? That sounds like an awful lot of bullshit to me.