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UBlock Origin

addons.mozilla.org

261–270 of 333 posts

Re: UBlock Origin

#261
post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn't true, I'm perfectly willing to pay for content. I just don't want ads and I don't want to be tracked. Thanks to browser extensions I don't have to no matter how much that hurts your feelings. You say I'm entitled but it's actually you who isn't entitled to control how the software works on my computer. I'm perfectly willing to support business models that aren't terrible. Perhaps you might also consider us…

We show an ask for donations in place of the ads for users who block our ads (Simple, subtle, using the same colors and fonts as the rest of the site so it isn't distracting). A handful of users do donate. The vast majority do not. Interestingly, the users who donate are also the ones most likely to whitelist our site. Most (but not all) users today feel entitled to content, games, music, etc for free and get mad whe…

Watching an ad is paying a price. If it's possible to get something for free without breaking the law and without other tangible negative consequences for yourself, why would you pay a price? Altruism, right? So watching ads is my altruistic duty now?

Re: UBlock Origin

#262
post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Go ahead and try to block users who block ads. People and companies have already tried that. In the end it's a game of cat and mouse with the AdBlockers finding a way to circumvent whatever detection the adblock-blockers are using.

It's called paywalls. Adblock will not get you around that.

Paywalls don't specifically block people who block ads. They're a completely different revenue strategy.

Re: UBlock Origin

#263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you only see a choice between "Free to Play" or hosting Ads then you have a problem greater than choosing your business model. You don't value your work enough to consider it valuable enough to pay for outright. First, ponder why that is, then address that issue.

Please... it's so easy to just dismiss these problems as "hey you should find a better business model" when lots of very smart people have been trying for a very long time. Free + ads vs Paid access are the only viable models today. Anything else is an offshoot of less ads with more donations or merchandise or something else but there's no real 3rd option. If there was, we would have figured it out by now dont you th…

The OP was asking for a alternative business model for his game. I suggested he had more important things to be concerned about. Did you reply to the wrong comment?

Re: UBlock Origin

#264
post #121
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would you like to go back to the AOL model, where sites got a proportion of the user's AOL subscription?

In fact, this exists. It's called Flattr.

Flattr is a donation model, not a subscription model. Donation models are much less lucrative in general than nearly anything else because you can just forget to donate after reading. This is why Exhibit A for the donation revenue model is non-profits.

Re: UBlock Origin

#265
post #35

Honest question - what business model for free content do you see other than ads? I understand all the privacy and distraction issues related, but increasingly many news sites I read feature only paid content. I suppose it's connected to the rise of ad blocking. At the moment I'm not hosting any content of such kind myself, but I wanted to publish a game and I'm facing the same question. Should I sell my soul to the…

>Should I sell my soul to the devil and work on freemium, coins, exploit OCD and rich-parents kids, You can do freemium without selling your soul. Look at LoL or Path of Exile for the best examples. Others would be Bloons TD 5 or Bloons City, where coins allow you to skip ahead, but slow downs are not purposefully added. Only when you add something that basically drains the fun out of the game unless money is spent a…

League of Legends is not a great example IMO. That game has a huge grindwall. Gaining access to just the gameplay-affecting elements of the game — not even looking at the cosmetic items — would cost hundreds and hundreds of dollars and take huge amounts of play time on top of that.

Re: UBlock Origin

#266
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you only see a choice between "Free to Play" or hosting Ads then you have a problem greater than choosing your business model. You don't value your work enough to consider it valuable enough to pay for outright. First, ponder why that is, then address that issue.

Because: * it's not what I want - I prefer to deliver it for free and do not plan for it to become any source of income, just to not have costs scaling with popularity * I don't need to sell it - I'm reasonably wealthy, with a good 40h/week job and salary. This is a side project and will loose it's charm when I convert it to a business project. * it's hard - I work on a browser-based game (no easy to implement paymen…

Oh, I hadn't figured you were making a web game. I've thought of working on one myself (that's as far as that goes however). I would consider myself lucky to have made a web game popular enough to be concerned about the cost of running it.

Re: UBlock Origin

#267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but chrisaljoudi just continued development and made some changes Yeah, there's more to it than that. Gorhill started it as a free and non-profit solution to help. He gave a lot of the credit to people maintaining the block lists. When he got tired of dealing with it, he transferred maintainership over to one of the devs that showed interest - chrisaljoudi. Who promptly started to monetize it. Like how he stripped…

> And then there's the removal of other developer's attribution. Which he thankfully stopped after everything blew up. Or his personal site which initially gave the impression that he was the sole creator of uBlock. https://github.com/chrisaljoudi/uBlock/commit/6850fa0a262b87... > Can you remove me as collaborator of the project please? Thanks. > @chrisaljoudi Remove me too from collaborators, please. They asked for…

No, it wasn't about removing contributors. It was about developer attribution - directly importing changes from others so they looked like his own commits. Inflating his personal contributions in a very un-Github style.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9449876

Everyone's mostly convinced that he did it because he's young and didn't think it through. We shouldn't lynch the kid - he's learned his lesson. But it's still understandable that people would prefer the original developer's version.

Which is why I posted my rebuttal.

Re: UBlock Origin

#268
post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It feels like a negligible harm to the other party, so we justify it to ourselves as victim-less, but it's not. The combined harm of all those that do so adds up the what is certainly a non-negligent level of harm in many cases. Think of it this way. Ad revenue is based on CPM, or cost per thousand ad views [0], which is itself based on the expected return of an ad view. The expected return obviously depends on how…

That only follows if you believe that viewing an advertisement is a discrete event with a discrete outcome, and has no outcome on future actions. Considering how much advertisement happens when you aren't in a position to immediately buy something, and how much research has gone into advertising and human perception, I don't believe that. Brand recognition works, at least in a lot of cases. But that doesn't even matt…

> I believe you agreed to a trade

It sounds like this is our fundamental disagreement. I do not believe that requesting an HTML resource is an agreement to load all external resources and execute all JavaScript referenced in that HTML. I submit the request, and the remote server returns some HTML. In my view, that is a complete interaction with no unfulfilled obligations.

According to your argument, I am not within my rights to cURL a URL if that URL happens to point to an HTML that references some ad-related JavaScript.

Re: UBlock Origin

#269
post #247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but chrisaljoudi just continued development and made some changes Yeah, there's more to it than that. Gorhill started it as a free and non-profit solution to help. He gave a lot of the credit to people maintaining the block lists. When he got tired of dealing with it, he transferred maintainership over to one of the devs that showed interest - chrisaljoudi. Who promptly started to monetize it. Like how he stripped…

Sorry, but that looks an awful lot like bad-mouthed rumours I don't like at all. https://github.com/chrisaljoudi/uBlock mentions gorhill and ublock origin in a positive way and asking for donations is totally fine - it would've been a bit strange if that was the first thing he did after getting the project, in an extensive way, but I did not see that while using the extension. Can't have been too bad. Seeking for don…

> looks an awful lot like bad-mouthed rumours

Really? So if we look at the Git repo commit history, we'll see the transition commit on April 1st (https://github.com/chrisaljoudi/uBlock/commit/bc4b7fc4ea17c8...). I'm pretty sure we can consider his first commit as demonstrating his intentions if it departs significantly from previous project direction. And it does - the very first commit after the transition was to start soliciting donations (https://github.com/chrisaljoudi/uBlock/commit/f256801344a517...). Git repositories have some reviewable history to them, but I guess that's all just rumours, right?

> Seeking for donations is especially a good idea since the original developer left the project because it was too much work -> counteract that work with money.

Perhaps. But in that same flurry of commits on his first day of project ownership, he linked to a personal donation account (https://github.com/chrisaljoudi/uBlock/commit/31a4a522814f06...). All that's said on that page (https://gratipay.com/~chrisaljoudi/) is that he works on uBlock. Part of the drama was that it previously implied more than just working on it - it was his. His wording has since given more recognition to the contributions of others, thankfully. But Day 1 - he's looking for donations, and its his project. Perhaps not terrible on any other day. But taking an open and free project, slapping personal donation buttons all over it, and removing attribution from other developers by manually committing changes (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9449876) - this behavior turned a lot of people off to his project and leadership. He's since talked about sharing those donations, which I think is good. I still think it would be better to not solicit them, but I don't personally value his contributions that highly any more. That's probably my own bias.

> https://github.com/chrisaljoudi/uBlock mentions gorhill and ublock origin in a positive way

Those changes are more recent, and came after a lot of public criticism. We can see from the commits that those came in a month and a half after the transition (https://github.com/chrisaljoudi/uBlock/commit/823778274bfd47...). Roughly 2-3 weeks after the video you linked. His first approach was publicity, and then he took a less aggressive approach. Let's not whitewash things when commit history shows that it's only 19 commits back (three of those from other people) from the current mainline on Jun 7th. Normal procedure when taking over project maintainership is to maintain - not reinvent the image for donations.

I personally think he saw the opportunity to get some cash for not a whole lot of work, which is a really attractive offer as a high school student. I don't think it was malicious, but I also don't think it was appropriate behavior to take something that was created for free to help others and personally monetize it the moment you got some authority over it. He found out that these things are considered unethical and changed. That's good - and we don't have to lynch him. High school kids do dumber things, and there's still room to learn and grow. But they're not rumours - these things actually happened.

There's a reason people prefer the the gorhill fork. I don't think Ajouldi's a bad kid, but I don't fault people for not trusting him after his very public missteps. I think he'll do much better things in the future - and I think part of that is him directly experiencing the fallout of a poor decision before he's gotten a career that could be affected by it. I won't crucify him, but I won't pretend he never did anything wrong just because he apologized.

Re: UBlock Origin

#270
post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's called paywalls. Adblock will not get you around that.

Paywalls don't specifically block people who block ads. They're a completely different revenue strategy.

That was my point, there's no way to perfectly stop adblockers since they are part of the client. The only way to stop them is to paywall, which will start to become more common.
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