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Aphantasia Beginner's Guide

aphantasia.com

261–270 of 476 posts

Re: Aphantasia Beginner's Guide

#261

For those that have this, how is your auditory imagination? I would not describe my thinking as especially visual, but I can hear things. It's much easier for me to imagine the crunch of someone biting an apple than the image of an apple itself. The effect is quite strong - I can hear music almost as well inside my head as actually listening to it; the sound of instruments, pitches (I don't think it's perfect pitch b…

I have multisensory aphantasia. I assumed everyone was like this until I read an HN thread a long time ago. I have a very strong inner monologue. For example, I can hear part of a song in my head. Ie the guitar but it's my inner voice initiating the sound of a guitar. But I cannot hear a whole song. Maybe it's what rhythm had always been a challenge for me with guitar and piano.

Re: Aphantasia Beginner's Guide

#262
I want to know if aphantasia is associated with any other mental models. For example, driving, map reading, spatial awareness.

I have a theory that Aphantasia is the symptom of something else, and this other thing relates to how the brain of such individuals stores information. I think it's stored in a more "compressed" state.

As an example, I find myself remembering where info is and not what the info acrually was.

Humans are not homogeneous. I think this is a huge evolutionary advantage, different mental modes improved our survivability.

But of course in modern day life such "divergence" can lead to pathology.

Re: Aphantasia Beginner's Guide

#263
I found out that people DO visualise about 10 years ago when that interview with Pixar's animation head came out. I had a bit of a shock at first, then disappointment, then a deeper understanding of why I am like I am. A few metaphorical minutes later I got on with life. I'm not sure how to take this "club" for the "mentally blind". On one hand, I applaud humanity's ability to monentise pretty much everything, and on the other hand, I'm not sure I want to talk about how I can't see in my mind with other people who can't see in their mind. It's a neat conversation piece when in a group of people or friends, but a club?... Jury's out... I did sign up though.... Took the "test"...

Re: Aphantasia Beginner's Guide

#264
post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but there is one question I keep coming back to: Is it a skill issue? Every time the topic of aphantasia comes up, this question always gets asked. I get that it's apparently inconceivable that someone who doesn't have aphantasia just assumes that everyone who claims they do is just doing it wrong or misunderstanding what the mind's eye is or that the claimant's own experience is just flat wrong. It's dismissive an…

> If someone is born without a sense of smell, they don't have people question if they really can't smell anything or if it's a skill issue. You're talking about something that affects 1 in 10,000 people and is very easily tested for. Whereas seemingly half of all people claim they have aphantasia, and nobody can agree on the definitions of any of the words we use to evaluate it. The situations are not at all similar…

> Whereas seemingly half of all people claim they have aphantasia

Citation needed.

People who experience something will be louder when that condition is brought up or relevant. That's a known phenomenon, it's why conservatives think trans people are everywhere.

Most statistics I've seen are more like 2-4% of the population, but it's not a very good measure because the vast majority of people do not know aphantasia is a thing. Hell, it's not even in my phones dictionary.

That might seem like a nitpick, but most of your comment seems to rely on aphantasia being widespread.

https://worldmetrics.org/aphantasia-statistics/ https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S10538...

Re: Aphantasia Beginner's Guide

#265

It would take a lot to convince me that aphantasia or phantasia actually exist. Let's talk very specifically about the afterimage test here. Can anyone confirm that they have this ability, which specifically is to superimpose imagined objects inside your actual field of vision? If the answer to this is yes, then okay, I guess I have aphantasia. But none of the other criteria seems to apply. I can imagine a song, and…

It exists. You're wrong. Update. Thanks.

Re: Aphantasia Beginner's Guide

#266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't this contracted by comments in this very thread? e.g. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49469205

Ever been lost in thought and ignored your external senses? That's what they're describing, but with visual imagery included and not just however you may normally experience thoughts.

Not really, actually, and not for a lack of trying very very hard at times. Even when we tried LSD the most it did was make us more aware of the actual curvature of our eyes' lenses, lessening the mental illusion of uniformity.

Re: Aphantasia Beginner's Guide

#267
post #111

I've known about aphantasia for a long time, but there is one question I keep coming back to: Is it a skill issue? When I was in second grade, our teacher asked us to close our eyes and imagine a pretzel. I closed my eyes and tried to will a pretzel to appear as an image, and I failed miserably. All I saw was darkness and faint squiggles. I didn't understand why so many of my classmates said they could "see" the pret…

I had aphantasia and then taught myself to see images too.

It’s possible aphantasia is something like deafness but there is no way anyone knows for sure either way.

People who think aphantasia is definitely similar to deafness probably are falling into the “efficient market hypothesis” trap. People assume scientific-sounding or clinical terms accepted by official sources are scientific. In reality, these official sounding (and even officially endorsed) terms materialize through domain-consensus which is different than the scientific process.

Domain-consensus allows for “magic words” that can’t be broken down into parts the same way something like deafness can be broken down into the material biological mechanisms that causes them. Psychology is a mind-field of these magic words because we have not yet unlocked mechanistic interpretability of the brain (the same way we are now trying for computer neural networks), and rather than breaking down categories of diagnoses into the behaviorisms we can observe (which many practitioners have had real-world success with), the academic and professional field has a culture of deferring to magic words/mechanisms that we can’t observe.

Regardless, nobody can know if aphantasia is a skill issue or immutable. My instinct is that most people probably blame having aphantasia when they don’t have it the same way people say they were born “not good at math.” However, it’s possible (although not necessarily true) a small portion of the population actually has it. There is no way to know for sure unless we understand the brain mechanistically which may be never.

Re: Aphantasia Beginner's Guide

#268

It would take a lot to convince me that aphantasia or phantasia actually exist. Let's talk very specifically about the afterimage test here. Can anyone confirm that they have this ability, which specifically is to superimpose imagined objects inside your actual field of vision? If the answer to this is yes, then okay, I guess I have aphantasia. But none of the other criteria seems to apply. I can imagine a song, and…

I'm going to second you for a different reason: I guess one thing I don't really get or perhaps don't by about phantasia is that the way our whole visual field works in a big illusion: we can really only see a tiny fraction at the center of our vision with any meaningful detail and we don't even realize each eye has a blindspot. Thus we can very easily believe we "see" something that we clearly do not see. To make th…

> most people don't even remember what a bicycle looks like

Not only people. LLMs too.

Re: Aphantasia Beginner's Guide

#269

It would take a lot to convince me that aphantasia or phantasia actually exist. Let's talk very specifically about the afterimage test here. Can anyone confirm that they have this ability, which specifically is to superimpose imagined objects inside your actual field of vision? If the answer to this is yes, then okay, I guess I have aphantasia. But none of the other criteria seems to apply. I can imagine a song, and…

They absolutely exist. I have a VERY strong minds eye and can invent and watch movies if I want to. Once I was driving while my friend described a post-apocalyptic landscape. I was seeing that landscape and not the road. Suddenly (some part of my brain was still paying attention, thankfully) the road rushed back to me and I saw that the cars in front of me had stopped. I had to slam on the brakes to avoid an accident…

I think you just have a different interpretation of how you "see" things. Sounds just like any other anecdote of getting distracted on the road, those can be dramatic, but nothing here points to actual visual hallucinations.

Re: Aphantasia Beginner's Guide

#270

It would take a lot to convince me that aphantasia or phantasia actually exist. Let's talk very specifically about the afterimage test here. Can anyone confirm that they have this ability, which specifically is to superimpose imagined objects inside your actual field of vision? If the answer to this is yes, then okay, I guess I have aphantasia. But none of the other criteria seems to apply. I can imagine a song, and…

I have hypophantasia, so it's very easy to convince me that both exist (because I'm right in the middle between the two)
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