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Android may soon restrict on-device ADB

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Re: Android may soon restrict on-device ADB

#261

Post by wartywhoa23 »

freedomben wrote: post #189
II2II wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In other words: this is all but impossible to impact regular users, and it requires a particularly careless developer to be hit by it. Have you ever worked with someone who barely knows how to use a mobile phone? They will hand their phone over to someone they barely even know to do something they don't understand. They will follow instructions from a stranger over the phone, without understanding what the phone is…

Following this logic, shouldn't we just ban smart phones for everyone then? If we need to dumb down all technology to the absolute lowest level, we should probably ban computers or at least require an official government-controlled license to get access to one. Is this a world you want to live in? Me neither.

Me personaly, I'm so fed up with these advocates of security-through-universal-presumption-of-imbecility!..

Re: Android may soon restrict on-device ADB

#263

Post by ordu »

wahnfrieden wrote: post #185
lucideer wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. I'm a developer, I've published Android apps, & I've still managed to lose access to a device that had dev settings enabled purely because remote adb enablement is a (extremely fiddly) toggle that happened to be off on the device at the time the screen broke. Having these two enabled simultaneously is such a rare case in the wild as to be entirely negligible as a vector.

Sometimes attacks happen from users being instructed to enable settings in order to achieve something regardless of whether you’d expect them to have a reason to use the setting

I think that these victims are paid by the likes of Google to create a precedent. It is unbelievable stupid scheme to fall to.

Re: Android may soon restrict on-device ADB

#264

Post by xethos »

jeroenhd wrote: post #86
eviks wrote: post #18

> Spamming the thread will only cause Google developers to lock the issue, ignore valuable community feedback, or stop sharing public updates about this change entirely. So nothing would change (they can also lock away your "valuable community feedback" because what bothers them is the criticism itself), thus feel free to express your approval

The moment an article like this hits HN or Reddit or any other such forum, any hope of changing anyone's mind is lost. The same happens to Github issues too. I haven't checked the isue myself, but seeing it here means it's probably already too late at this point, it'll probably get flooded. Google does take feedback from app developers every now and then, but obviously their own teams' feelings on the subject are mor…

In 2008 Sergey Brin and Larry Page saw the limo waiting, and instead chose to rollerblade to the Android unveiling. Sergey Brin, during the presentation, threw his G1 in the air to show off how his homemade application leveraged the accelerometer to see how high he'd thrown it

That use-case was never designed for when the sensor was added, and is every bit as hacky and fun as adding call recording with a loopbakc address

And that's the first problem: Android is no longer fun, and it's no longer for trying this hilariously stupid hacky method of doing what we, the users, want.

The second problem is an attitude of "Google's dialer has it built-in, why would one want a third-party dialer instead of Google's?"

Because we fucking can - or could, at least. The OS was designed to be as modular as possible, to the point where, while iOS still can't change their launcher, Android has had that option since day one. Setting aside Google casting themselves as the (not so) benevolent dictator of "Just use our apps exclusively. Life will be easier that way", closing off the modularity is antithecal to the Android experience that so many geeks fell in love with, and arguably made the platform what it is

Re: Android may soon restrict on-device ADB

#266

Post by wartywhoa23 »

ryandrake wrote: post #209
crote wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems to require the user to: 1. Enable Developer Mode by going to an obscure settings page and tapping the build number seven times 2. Enable USB ADB debugging in the Developer Options 3. Establish an actual USB ADB session 4. Enable TCP/IP ADB debugging in the Developer Options 5. Unknowingly download a malware app from the official Play Store 6. Blindly click "Yes" on the permission prompt. In other words: this…

I think expert users on HN seriously downplay the ability and willingness of "regular users" to do very stupid things on their devices. If grandma wants that app that gives her a beautiful horse as a lock screen image, she will follow every one of those six steps that the malware HorseLockScreen app developer presents to her. She will tap a button that has a skull and crossbones icon, that says "tapping this will dra…

> let's not downplay the blast radius of basically every attack that involves telling the user to do things.

That radius would be negligible should the things that must remain secret remain offline.

But no, that's a luddite thing to even think about in an all-connected ever-online world where even wiping one's ass is done via of a swarm of dedicated apps.

On the other hand, there has always been a way to extract secrets from a granny via a mere voice call, so no amount of dumbing it down would really help.

Re: Android may soon restrict on-device ADB

#267

Post by duskdozer »

phoghed wrote: post #182
yyhhsj0521 wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

New CVE found in Bank of America app that may cause user to transfer money to hackers if they press certain combination of keys.

More like if you have some settings enabled someone on your network can do it for you without your permission

More like the credit card company can initiate automatic withdrawals from your bank account without your permission if you previously authorized the company to do autopay.

Re: Android may soon restrict on-device ADB

#268

Post by lofaszvanitt »

oblio wrote: post #206
sigmoid10 wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google just got hit by yet another record antitrust fine by the EU [1]. But as long as they see these fines as cost of doing business, nothing will change. Especially if it always takes almost a decade to push this through the judicial system. Their net income last year alone was $130 Billion. [1] https://www.reuters.com/world/eu-top-court-dismisses-google-...

The EU shouldn't be regulating Google like this. The US should.

Hopeless. US already lost against corps. And that will be their downfall.

Re: Android may soon restrict on-device ADB

#269

Post by froggit »

freedomben wrote: post #189
II2II wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In other words: this is all but impossible to impact regular users, and it requires a particularly careless developer to be hit by it. Have you ever worked with someone who barely knows how to use a mobile phone? They will hand their phone over to someone they barely even know to do something they don't understand. They will follow instructions from a stranger over the phone, without understanding what the phone is…

Following this logic, shouldn't we just ban smart phones for everyone then? If we need to dumb down all technology to the absolute lowest level, we should probably ban computers or at least require an official government-controlled license to get access to one. Is this a world you want to live in? Me neither.

> ban computers or at least require an official government-controlled license to get access to one

People seem to be ok with needing a license to operate a motor vehicle and those are far less dangerous.

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