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France's homegrown open source online office suite

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Re: France's homegrown open source online office suite

#261

Post by victorbjorklund »

ecshafer wrote: post #100
Nesco wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which it can’t. There is nothing to disagree about. With current demographics projection no amount of taxes can cover welfare states

The welfare state can not exist in world where the government is against population growth. You cant have a robust welfare state and make through policy and propaganda 4+ child families rare. We need an exponential curve of population to maintain it, especialy when its at european levels. Mass immigration of uneducated people from low income countries doesnt cover the gap, especially when the government extends welfa…

Hungary is a welfare state.

Re: France's homegrown open source online office suite

#262

Post by gavmor »

IlikeMadison wrote: post #246

Python and TypeScript... hard pass. Mediocre software made by mediocre web developers. Imagine a car manufacturer using wood instead of steel because they can only afford to pay cheap lumberjacks.

Ouch, harsh words!

But, what would be your stack of choice? Or, what stack gives you the most confidence?

Re: France's homegrown open source online office suite

#263

Post by victorbjorklund »

ecshafer wrote: post #236
lII1lIlI11ll wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You cant have a robust welfare state and make through policy and propaganda 4+ child families rare. I'm curios what do you mean by this. Could you provide some examples of such policies or propaganda campaigns?

Legalizing abortion, unneeded regulations that require car seats at later ages which disincentivize more children for lack of car space, zoning that removes green space and side walks in favor of car infrastructure, expensive education and health insurance (family premiums are insane compared to individual), incentivizing two worker house holds through tax policy.

Health insurance? Are you sure you are talking about welfare states and not America? Which welfare state has expensive education and health insurances?

Re: France's homegrown open source online office suite

#264

Post by michelsedgh »

Normal_gaussian wrote: post #234
michelsedgh wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

its not about leverage or threat, same as the office products, the french owned their docs at the end of the day, i thought it was about sovereignty and using french alternatives?

If you have the docs, but not the means to (legally) read and edit them, do you really own them? When MS pulls services you are largely screwed. When GitHub pulls services its a few hours downtime and a new provider.

[flagged]

Re: France's homegrown open source online office suite

#265

Post by thibaut_barrere »

okanat wrote: post #26

Okay this is nowhere near an "Office suite". It is a cloud collaboration suite with a glorified markdown editor and with some extra utilities around. Almost nobody buys stuff like Google Docs and Microsoft Office for this reason. From my experience using open-source collaboration groupware like Nextcloud, their solutions written in dynamic programming languages like PHP and Python are always woefully slow. Only thing…

From the FAQ:

> With Docs our job is not to replace Microsoft Office

https://docs.numerique.gouv.fr/docs/ed2e1dbf-07a2-43bb-ae1e-...

Also: like when switching from AWS to EU provider, the goal is not feature parity. Not only it is costly to implement, but also a reason why so many features are in AWS or Office is to ensure vendor lock-in due to feature comparisons.

Learning to do more with less is a feature, not a bug.

Re: France's homegrown open source online office suite

#266

Post by lucb1e »

mabedan wrote: post #190
savant2 wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Genuine question: why do you consider it to be nowhere near an "Office suite"? It seems to me it fits the definition given by Wikipedia [1]. I guess it is less advanced than Google Workspace or Microsoft Office but it would cover all of my needs at work. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Productivity_software#Office_s...

Google Docs is a document editor (opening/saving Microsoft office compatible documents, with layout, etc), not a wiki/markdown editor. The La Suite Docs seems a product more similar to Atlassian Confluence.

> (opening/saving Microsoft office compatible documents, with layout, etc)

Not being Microsoft Office®-compatible does not make something not an office suite. In that case, there is (by design) only one Office® suite in the world

> not a wiki/markdown editor

I was wondering if you meant WYSIWYG editing as opposed to markdown editing, but then you say

> La Suite Docs seems a product more similar to Atlassian Confluence

which is WYSIWYG (the best web-based wysiwyg editor I've ever used, in fact; even if I'd never choose it for being a vendor lock-in that has shown they want to own your data by removing the self-hosted options, maybe with exceptions for giant enterprises idk but at least we had to migrate and it wasn't fun)

so then what are you saying? What makes an 'office suite' an office suite to you?

Re: France's homegrown open source online office suite

#267

Post by mytailorisrich »

The problem is that open-source projects funded by the taxpayer bring nothing long term to create companies that can compete or generate economic growth or develop future industries. They would be much better off creating a more business friendly environment and supporting private businesses through grants, procurements, etc the way the US are good at.

Re: France's homegrown open source online office suite

#268

Post by lucb1e »

zdc1 wrote: post #139
okanat wrote: post #26

Okay this is nowhere near an "Office suite". It is a cloud collaboration suite with a glorified markdown editor and with some extra utilities around. Almost nobody buys stuff like Google Docs and Microsoft Office for this reason. From my experience using open-source collaboration groupware like Nextcloud, their solutions written in dynamic programming languages like PHP and Python are always woefully slow. Only thing…

My initial thought was: why not fork LibreOffice and spend the extra dev time closing the gap between what it is and what they need? But after some thought, I feel a cloud collaboration suite makes more sense as big orgs often run on online-first solutions like Sharepoint. So they can tick the essential boxes by being an online collaboration suite, and fill in formatting features later. Though your points on speed an…

> why not fork LibreOffice [...] But after some thought, I feel a cloud collaboration suite makes more sense

LibreOffice has a cloud version :). From what they presented at T-Dose like 10 years ago, it's basically an instance of the software running on the server, cut up into tiles and displayed on a webpage as zoomable image using Leafletjs, the same way that google maps worked before switching to vector graphics 15 years ago. Clicks and other input events are presumably emulated on the server and the resulting display update is sent back to the client, a bit like VNC but using a map library

Re: France's homegrown open source online office suite

#269

Post by saubeidl »

nickpp wrote: post #192
saubeidl wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah but the tech spend was way more effective. Elon took over Twitter.

So no, they didn't "bought Trump the election". And the fact that a 3rd party supports an opponent does not kill any politician's career. Biden retired by himself, following his own party's pressure. And Harris is still around, I believe.

Of course they did. They used their capital to influence democracy. That's capitalism baby!

Re: France's homegrown open source online office suite

#270

Post by saubeidl »

ipaddr wrote: post #253
Gud wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hacker, as in capable… not as the media redefined term

Was referring to an actual hacker who does look for holes in systems not the 60s idealist version of a hacker as someone who plays nor the media evil shadowly character.

I was referring to a hacker as Stallman would've used the term. This sorta stuff: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hacker_culture

> Richard Stallman explains about hackers who program:

> What they had in common was mainly love of excellence and programming. They wanted to make their programs that they used be as good as they could. They also wanted to make them do neat things. They wanted to be able to do something in a more exciting way than anyone believed possible and show "Look how wonderful this is. I bet you didn't believe this could be done."

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