Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Thin desires are eating life

joanwestenberg.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

261–270 of 285 posts

Re: Thin desires are eating life

#261

Post by andai »

ianstormtaylor wrote: post #47

I can't help but feel that this article was written in a format that is the textual equivalent of thin desires… Every sentence is separated into its own paragraph, like each one is supposed to be revelatory (or maybe tweet-worthy). It's pretty common design knowledge that if you try to emphasize everything, you end up emphasizing nothing. The result is that reading the article feels choppy, and weirdly unsatisfying,…

So that the people with the most rotted brains -- those caught fully in the thick of thin things! -- stand a chance of reading it.

Source: I talk to zoomers. (Some of them couldn't make it through an article of this length...)

Re: Thin desires are eating life

#262

Post by atentaten »

NegativeK wrote: post #142
clowncubs wrote: post #55

This resonates. I work in web dev, and a little over 2 years ago I hit a wall. Everything was a screen. All day at work, at home, on the go. Everything felt hallow and unrewarding. I'm an introvert, so outside of my family, I didn't have many relationships. Of course, I was depressed. I began working on it by going to therapy and then one day I decided to try sculpting. This changed everything. I found I was pretty g…

I've taken somewhat of a parallel path. I set foot in a shop for the first time at a hackerspace 11 or 12 years ago and eventually feel deep into machining. I spent huge swaths of my days there, and when I wasn't, I was reading about machining. Books, because there were few Youtubers doing it and the forums are thin. It's not a popular hobby and a lot of the professionals and hobbyists aren't computer savvy. I focuse…

What is the other hobby?

Re: Thin desires are eating life

#263

Post by justonceokay »

adamhartenz wrote: post #244

Wow, this seems like a lot of folks first encounter with a lyrical essay. I won't hold that against anyone. I have heard many things about the American school system. Writing like this is meant to be felt as much as evaluated. The argument matters, but the cadence and emotional momentum matter just as much. The author give you are chance to think about each point that is being said. Our dopamine addicted brains can't…

It’s uncomfortable for some people to experience an idea they can’t fit in their head all at once

Re: Thin desires are eating life

#264

Post by NegativeK »

atentaten wrote: post #262
NegativeK wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've taken somewhat of a parallel path. I set foot in a shop for the first time at a hackerspace 11 or 12 years ago and eventually feel deep into machining. I spent huge swaths of my days there, and when I wasn't, I was reading about machining. Books, because there were few Youtubers doing it and the forums are thin. It's not a popular hobby and a lot of the professionals and hobbyists aren't computer savvy. I focuse…

What is the other hobby?

It was climbing, but that one I've fully walked away from.

Re: Thin desires are eating life

#265

Post by NegativeK »

2b3a51 wrote: post #231
NegativeK wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've taken somewhat of a parallel path. I set foot in a shop for the first time at a hackerspace 11 or 12 years ago and eventually feel deep into machining. I spent huge swaths of my days there, and when I wasn't, I was reading about machining. Books, because there were few Youtubers doing it and the forums are thin. It's not a popular hobby and a lot of the professionals and hobbyists aren't computer savvy. I focuse…

If (and I mean only if it would be interesting to you, no other reason and no implied 'ought') you wanted, I'm pretty sure that there are people out there who would like to return things like telescope mountings, old focusers, mechanical devices of all kinds to a working state. Over here in the UK, people volunteer at steam engine workshops and even in jewellery workshops to restore things. And they get a supply of i…

I don't know if that's a thing here in the states, but I'll keep it in mind! It probably wouldn't be hard to advertise via the local (different) hackerspace.

But I'll probably have to get through my backlog of current tasks and projects before I wanted to take on other peoples'. And I may have literally set up a wiki to track those projects...

Re: Thin desires are eating life

#266

Post by canyp »

adamhartenz wrote: post #244

Wow, this seems like a lot of folks first encounter with a lyrical essay. I won't hold that against anyone. I have heard many things about the American school system. Writing like this is meant to be felt as much as evaluated. The argument matters, but the cadence and emotional momentum matter just as much. The author give you are chance to think about each point that is being said. Our dopamine addicted brains can't…

It also reflects how very little some people have read.

Re: Thin desires are eating life

#267

Post by canyp »

CGMthrowaway wrote: post #230
WhatsTheBigIdea wrote: post #177

I really like this article. I bake bread. I have spent a good deal of time optimizing the recipe for deliciousness but also for time efficiency. Proving in a warm oven is a great tip. Also baking two loaves at a time! All this nit picking about writing style is disappointing. I like that this person got their ideas out there. They are good ideas. Legible and easy to parse == good enough. I don't care about the writin…

I asked my agent to rewrite this in a more traditional style, if it's helpful to anyone: A defining experience of our age is a paradoxical hunger: we crave more even when we have an excess, and we crave less while more accumulates around us. It is a vague hunger we often can’t articulate, a deep sense of wanting something fundamental. This is the essence of "thin desire": a craving for something undefinable and ultim…

To put it politely, nobody gives two shits about what "your agent" said, in case you were wondering why this was downvoted to hell. This reply adds nothing to the conversation, and it also doesn't take a mastermind to figure they, too, can paste the post in ChatGPT and get a summary out of it. Also, reading a summary instead of the sources butchers the post entirely.

Hopefully you'll spare us the spam next time. Have a good day!

Re: Thin desires are eating life

#268

Post by GMoromisato »

This is an interesting piece, and it resonates with me. I remember when Guitar Hero came out and I shook my head at all the kids spending hours mastering it instead of just picking up a guitar and practicing.

But maybe our dissatisfaction isn't about thin vs. thick desires, maybe it's that we're exposed to a world (via the internet/social media) in which everyone is more successful than us. Even/especially on Hacker News, we're hit over the head with all the YC companies raising money, hiring A-players, releasing world-changing products.

When the world makes you feel like a slacker, it's no wonder we value thick desires. They become the lifeline to get out of our hole. If only I knew calculus, I could work for SpaceX and launch rockets. If only I understood gradient-descent, I could get hired by an AI company. If only I took the time to bake my own bread, maybe I wouldn't feel like such a loser.

This is a relatively new phenomenon, I think. Growing up in the 80s, before the internet, we could only compare ourselves to our friends and classmates. With such a small pool of people, we could always stand out at something. Maybe we were in the top three at basketball, or maybe we always got As in history, or maybe we were good at making girls laugh. And even if there was nothing special about us, it didn't matter: there was nothing special about anyone! We were happy to pursue thin desires because we didn't need to be more than we were. If we worked hard, it was to earn more money. If we practiced an instrument, it was because we enjoyed it. No one ever worried about "what it all means". There's a reason we called such philosophical musings "sophomoric".

And if you think about it, there's nothing special about "thick desires" either. Yes, learning how to play piano changes us. But so what? Why do want to be different? Is it to stand out? Is it to impress others? Is it to be able to say, "I can play piano"? Maybe they are all thin desires. Maybe it's all just a way to pass the time. Is learning about all the Impressionists really any different than memorizing the fire-type Pokemons?

I think having kids fundamentally changed my brain. Once you have kids and get exposed to the firehose of emotions they elicit, everything else becomes shallow. There is no 3 Michelin Star meal, no trek through the rainforest, no mastery of unusual skills that brings me as much pleasure as making my daughter laugh.

We used to know that. We used to know what it meant to live a good life. But now it's a mystery.

Re: Thin desires are eating life

#269

Post by yuni_aigc »

clowncubs wrote: post #55

This resonates. I work in web dev, and a little over 2 years ago I hit a wall. Everything was a screen. All day at work, at home, on the go. Everything felt hallow and unrewarding. I'm an introvert, so outside of my family, I didn't have many relationships. Of course, I was depressed. I began working on it by going to therapy and then one day I decided to try sculpting. This changed everything. I found I was pretty g…

I can totally relate—I’m also a web dev and spend all day in front of screens. Lately I’ve been feeling really stuck and weighed down, and honestly I’m not sure how to start changing things. Reading your story gives me a little hope, though.

Re: Thin desires are eating life

#270

Post by rpdillon »

xpe wrote: post #60
rpdillon wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The wording was very careful to say the pursuit of the desire changes you. That's very different than obtaining the desire changing you. It's not a real remedy for your comment because we could probably come up with an example where the pursuit of the desire changes you in a bad way. For example, if you're a heroin addict and you're breaking into homes to steal things so that you can buy drugs. But I think it does he…

I appreciate your clarity, thanks. There is something really interesting about people (which I think I'm borrowing from Atomic Habits by James Clear): Every time you take an action in service of a goal, it helps prove to yourself , a little at a time, that part of your identity involves pursuing that goal. For example, each time I spew out a journal entry or cobble together a blog post, it reinforces the belief "I am…

I think there are several dimensions.

There's the motivation, the pursuit, and the achievement, and the consequences of each. I think it's fairly easy to tease apart the motivation and the pursuit, but you're focusing on a much more nuanced aspect of the action and its consequences. These really are tied strongly, but worth addressing individually.

As you point out, some actions are motivated and pursued because of the consequences of the achievement (writing a book or song, founding a company, being elected president). But others are intrinsically rewarding, which is usually shorter term.

Post reply on HN