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ALICE detects the conversion of lead into gold at the LHC

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Re: ALICE detects the conversion of lead into gold at the LHC

#261

Post by Izkata »

BuyMyBitcoins wrote: post #74
yieldcrv wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

we just need a bigger transmutation circle bro, trust me, just one more transmutation circle, and we’ll finally turn organic material into gold, bro, just around the whole city bro, one more time

I can’t quite put this into words but the idea of a transmutation circle actually being the track of a particle collider is just so funny to me.

One episode of The Librarians involves a college student building a mini particle accelerator that (unintentionally) uses a magic circle around the campus as its track, which when activated opens a portal into another dimension filled with monsters.

Re: ALICE detects the conversion of lead into gold at the LHC

#263

Post by greenavocado »

aledalgrande wrote: post #259
greenavocado wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With this process we could produce about 65.4g of gold with the energy needed to boil the entire ocean once to full vaporization. The Earth's oceans contain approximately 1.4 x 10^21 kilograms of water, which equals 1.4 x 10^24 grams. The average ocean temperature is about 3.5 degrees Celsius, and we need to heat it to the boiling point of seawater at approximately 100 degrees Celsius, for a temperature difference of…

How big of a burger could you sizzle with that energy?

Hard to say because if you wanted to cook it properly but still apply the energy of the vaporized oceans the size would have to be so massive that it would collapse upon itself due to its own gravity and initiate nuclear fusion

Re: ALICE detects the conversion of lead into gold at the LHC

#264

Post by reactordev »

cenamus wrote: post #127
bgirard wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only if the LHC doesn't quire gold to operate. If you're using ICs and components that have some gold in them and they need maintenance, you consume more than you produce.

Can still recover the gold from old parts though. Quite fitting actually, alchemists scamming investors with needing a "starting" amount to get their reaction going

You mean like gas money?

Re: ALICE detects the conversion of lead into gold at the LHC

#265

Post by int_19h »

svachalek wrote: post #235
oblio wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> particle accelerators, stars, and supernovae I have no clue about this stuff, but don't black holes also change matter... somehow? I mean, with all that gravity and stuff, crazy things must happen in there, right?

As I understand contemporary physics, once matter crosses the event horizon it becomes part of the singularity. The singularity behaves as a single super-sized particle, so nothing happens inside. However I also have heard that many physicists don't believe that singularities actually exist, it's just the best mathematical model we have for physics that are too extreme for us to measure.

It does not become part of the singularity once it crosses the event horizon. The event horizon is actually rather uneventful as far as any particular piece of matter crossing it goes - it only means that this matter can never leave the boundary defined by the horizon, but it doesn't change it otherwise. The singularity (if it even exists) is the thing at the center of the black hole, far below its event horizon.

Re: ALICE detects the conversion of lead into gold at the LHC

#266

Post by dheera »

omnee wrote: post #42

The relevant part: "The ALICE analysis shows that, during Run 2 of the LHC (2015–2018), about 86 billion gold nuclei were created at the four major experiments. In terms of mass, this corresponds to just 29 picograms (2.9 ×10-11 g)." Just need to scale it by trillions to make 1 ounce, but transmutation of lead to gold - the dream of many alchemists - is now just a by product of particle accelerators.

I hope that this can one day be scaled, even if 100 years into the future.

I do not want gold to be prized as a store of value. It is too useful as a material (inert, doesn't oxidize, food safe) that it would be vastly beneficial to society if it were possible to produce in limitless quantities.

Pick something that isn't useful as a material to be a store of value.

Re: ALICE detects the conversion of lead into gold at the LHC

#267

Post by oakmad »

CGMthrowaway wrote: post #57
omnee wrote: post #42

The relevant part: "The ALICE analysis shows that, during Run 2 of the LHC (2015–2018), about 86 billion gold nuclei were created at the four major experiments. In terms of mass, this corresponds to just 29 picograms (2.9 ×10-11 g)." Just need to scale it by trillions to make 1 ounce, but transmutation of lead to gold - the dream of many alchemists - is now just a by product of particle accelerators.

Ran the numbers. The LHC would break even if the price of gold was $48 trillion trillion per ounce.

My high school science teacher(Brother Quinn in the 80s) always said it was possible, although rather expensive, now I know how much - thanks.

Re: ALICE detects the conversion of lead into gold at the LHC

#268

Post by int_19h »

jrvieira wrote: post #44
marcodiego wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A friend of mine who was into alchemy, told me it was because the difference was only three protons. I don't if early alchemists knew that or why not consider metals that are less than three protons different from gold.

no, alchemists didn't know about protons

They did know about density, though, which is closely linked.

Re: ALICE detects the conversion of lead into gold at the LHC

#269

Post by saghm »

dheera wrote: post #266
omnee wrote: post #42

The relevant part: "The ALICE analysis shows that, during Run 2 of the LHC (2015–2018), about 86 billion gold nuclei were created at the four major experiments. In terms of mass, this corresponds to just 29 picograms (2.9 ×10-11 g)." Just need to scale it by trillions to make 1 ounce, but transmutation of lead to gold - the dream of many alchemists - is now just a by product of particle accelerators.

I hope that this can one day be scaled, even if 100 years into the future. I do not want gold to be prized as a store of value. It is too useful as a material (inert, doesn't oxidize, food safe) that it would be vastly beneficial to society if it were possible to produce in limitless quantities. Pick something that isn't useful as a material to be a store of value.

I can't help but worry that the technology wouldn't be enough to solve the way social problem of existing stakeholders not wanting to lose the value of their investments. I'm not sure exactly how comparable it is from a utility perspective, but diamond seems like there would at least some incentive to have available cheaply given how durable it is, but my understanding is that its scarcity is almost entirely artificial, and for non-utility purposes, it seems unfortunately very common for people to prefer "real" diamond, which fuels the inflated pricing.

That's not to say I think this shouldn't be pursued, but I feel like the science and technology side might end up being the easier half of cheap gold from this becoming a reality. I sadly have more faith in humanity's ability to figure out solutions to incredibly difficult technical problems in the long run than I do in our ability to solve the social problems that would benefit almost everyone but require changing the status quo.

(As an aside, I personally find the idea of lab-grown diamonds pretty cool just from a science perspective, and the fact that they're cheaper and don't have the same ethical concerns to make it unfathomable that I'd ever want to purchase a mined one, and I'm lucky that my wife felt the same way when we picked out her engagement ring, although she ended up selecting a lab-grown pink sapphire instead).

Re: ALICE detects the conversion of lead into gold at the LHC

#270

Post by AngryData »

timcobb wrote: post #136
omnee wrote: post #42

The relevant part: "The ALICE analysis shows that, during Run 2 of the LHC (2015–2018), about 86 billion gold nuclei were created at the four major experiments. In terms of mass, this corresponds to just 29 picograms (2.9 ×10-11 g)." Just need to scale it by trillions to make 1 ounce, but transmutation of lead to gold - the dream of many alchemists - is now just a by product of particle accelerators.

Have we transmutated lead to gold in other ways?

Stick some in a nuclear reactor and it is bound to happen. But it obviously isn't economical to sort out a few specs from the soup of other exotic and probably unstable elements.
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