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Apple introduces M4 chip

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Re: Apple introduces M4 chip

#261

I love when Gruber is confidently wrong https://daringfireball.net/linked/2024/04/28/m4-ipad-pros-gu...

> or Apple’s silicon game is racing far ahead of what I considered possible

Gruber's strange assumption here is that a new number means some major improvements. Apple has never really been consistent about sticking to patterns in product releases.

Re: Apple introduces M4 chip

#262

Seeing an M series chip launch first in an iPad must be result of some mad supply chain and manufacturing related hangovers from COVID. If the iPad had better software and could be considered a first class productivity machine then it would be less surprising but the one thing no one says about the iPads is “I wish this chip were faster”

My guess is that the M4 and M3 are functionally almost identical so there's no real reason for them to restrict the iPad M4 launch until they get the chip into the MacBook / Air.

Re: Apple introduces M4 chip

#263
post #241

No mention of battery life. They keep making stuff thin, and unupgradeable. What's the point of buying an apple device that is going to wear out in 5 years?

Battery replacement costs $200. It's not like you just have to throw it in the trash if the battery dies.

Re: Apple introduces M4 chip

#264
> M4 has Apple’s fastest Neural Engine ever, capable of up to 38 trillion operations per second, which is faster than the neural processing unit of any AI PC today.

I always wonder what crazy meds Apple employees are on. Two RTX 4090s is quite common for hobbyist use, and that is 1321 TOPS each, making two over 69 times more than what Apple claims to be the fastest in the world. That performance is literally less than 1 % of a single H200.

Talk about misleading marketing...

Re: Apple introduces M4 chip

#265

Does anyone know how much of this giant leap performance as Apple puts it is really useful and perceived by end users of iPad. I am thinking gaming, art applications on iPad. What other major ipad use cases are out there that need this kind of performance boost.

Making music. The iPad is much better for performing than a computer. There is a huge range of instruments, effects, sequencers, etc. available on the iPad. Things like physical modeling and chained reverb can eat up processor cycles so more performance is always welcomed.

Both Final Cut Pro and Davinci resolve can also use as much power as you can give them though it isn’t clear to me why you’d use an iPad instead of a Mac. They also announced a crazy multicam app for iPads and iPhones that allows remote control of a bunch of iPhones at the same time.

Re: Apple introduces M4 chip

#267
post #43

The 256gb and 512gb models have 8gb of ram. The 1tb and 2tb models have 16gb. Not a fan of tying ram to storage. https://www.apple.com/ipad-pro/specs/

The economic reasoning behind this doesn't make sense to me. What do they lose by allowing slightly more freedom in configurations?

The GP comment can be misleading because it suggests Apple is tying storage to ram. That is not the case (at least not directly).

The RAM and system-on-chip are tied together as part of the system-on-package. The SoP is what enables M chips to hit their incredible memory bandwidth numbers.

This is not an easy thing to allow configuration. They can’t just plug a different memory chip as a final assembly step before shipping.

They only have two SoPs as part of this launch: 9-core CPU with 8gb, and 10-core CPU with 16gb. The RAM is unified for cpu/gpu (and I would assume neural engine too).

Each new SoP is going to reduce economies of scale and increase supply chain complexity. The 256/512gb models are tied to the first package, the 1/2tb models are tied to the second. Again, these are all part of the PCB, so production decisions have to be made way ahead of consumer orders.

Maybe it’s not perfect for each individual’s needs, but it seems reasonable to assume that those with greater storage needs also would benefit from more compute and RAM. That is, you need more storage to handle more video production so you are probably more likely to use more advanced features which make better use of increased compute and RAM.

Re: Apple introduces M4 chip

#269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If these things will ever get MacOS support it will be useless with 8 GB of Ram. Such a waste of nice components.

> If these things will ever get MacOS support The Macbook line will get iPadOS support long before they allow MacOS on this line. Full steam ahead towards the walled garden.

iOS has become such a waste of great hardware, especially in the larger form factor of the iPad.

M1 chips, great screens, precise pencil input and keyboard support, but we still aren't permitted a serious OS on it, to protect the monopolistic store.

App Stores have beeen around long enough to prove that they're little more than laboratories in which to carry out accelerated enshittification experimentation. Everything so dumbed down and feature-light, yet demanding subscriptions or pushing endless scammy ads. And games that are a shameless introduction to gambling addiction, targeted at kids.

Most of the 'apps' that people actually use shouldn't need to be native apps anyway, they should be websites. And now we get the further enshittification of trying to force people out of the browser and into apps, not for a better experience, but for a worse one, where more data can be harvested and ads can't so easily be blocked...

Re: Apple introduces M4 chip

#270
post #11

I’m far from an expert in Apple silicon, but this strikes me as having some conservative improvements. And in-depth info out there yet?

I'm guessing that the "ML accelerator" in the CPU cores means one of ARM's SME extensions for matrix multiplication. SME in ARM v8.4-A adds dot product instructions. v8.6-A adds more, including BF16 support.

https://community.arm.com/arm-community-blogs/b/architecture...

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