Live data from Hacker News

Philips Hue will soon force users to create an account

defcon.social

261–270 of 338 posts

Re: Philips Hue will soon force users to create an account

#261
post #168
post #113

"What's the worst that could happen, if we let MBA-types take over engineering?" "Even your home's light bulbs will require an Internet-connected computer account that spies on you."

I don't recall any of this short-sighted, anti-consumer nonsense when I earned my MBA. I do remember a focus on ethics and doing right by the consumer. There was a lot of corporate social responsibility stuff that I thought was going to be a drag and then it ended up being pretty informative. I suspect MBA-types often get a bad rap because pretty much everyone has had a shitty boss before and that person may have had…

If A then B does not imply If B then A

But, "If A then B" & "B" together do create a signal for A. The strength of that signal is dependent on the statistics involved.

In this context, A is a bad boss and B is getting an MBA.

Relevant statistics would be the distribution of degrees among bad bosses, the frequency of good boss vs bad boss, the proportion of degree holders that are bad bosses, etc

There is a valid signal, the question is how strong it actually is and how much it is overplayed.

This is an incredibly widespread issue when generalized beyond MBAs and bad bosses. I think people fall into roughly 4 stages with it:

1) people do not know its a logical fallacy to begin with, and treat the signal as a full on implication

2) people learn of the fallacy and think the technicality of it as a fallacy means the signal cannot exist at all

3) people acknowledge the signal exists but dont know how to influence their opinion with it

And 4) people try to understand the statistics involved in each instance to form a personal intuition on the signal strength

Imo I feel like the large majority of people are 1 (hence widespread stigmas that are overplayed) and then the large majority of anyone who isn't a 1 is a 2 and a smart-ass (meaning the 2s are not convincing the 1s to change). 3 is probably where most thinkers end up on most subjects, and 4 is very tedious to keep up with and has questionable reward value for doing so.

I've seen someone do the math on working out the probability for A|B when If A then B for some chosen example, but unfortunately I don't have the reference. Would be cool to see again.

To give a simple example though, assume A is English is the primary language someone knows and B is a preference for speaking and writing in English. If someone only knows English it follows they will speak and write in English. If someone speaks and writes in English, it does not follow that English is the only language they know.

If you see someone speaking and writing in english, there is obviously some signal there that they might only know English.

That signal changes depending on the % of English speakers who know a second language. And in fact, if 0% of English speakers spoke another language then suddenly If B then A does become a true statement.

I really wish I could instill this insight into everyone on Earth tbh. Misunderstanding that signal causes so many problems

Re: Philips Hue will soon force users to create an account

#262
post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't forget highly locked down garage doors that are readily accessible by major merchants. And also pair easily with similarly locked down in garage cameras.

I am actually looking for a wallmount garage door opener right now. While they do have myq-whatever cloud thing, my understanding is that it's optional. It should be possible to connect an ESP32 or the Konnected sensor thing which will pretend to be a wall button from the opener perspective. Could probably even stick it into a Faraday cage to prevent Amazon sidewalk scenario. Is that not really an option?

A lot of newer garage door openers, especially Chamberlain, don't use simple contact switches on the wall any more. Hacking the remote in this way is still possible by disassembling the wall remote and simulating the button press itself, but it is a lot trickier than with simpler garage doors.

And myq cloud is horrible and worth avoiding. They used to have a homekit bridge, but they discontinued it.

Re: Philips Hue will soon force users to create an account

#263
post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't forget highly locked down garage doors that are readily accessible by major merchants. And also pair easily with similarly locked down in garage cameras.

I have a rental and I absolutely hate that thing. ads every time I want to leave the house. and it keeps switching to some kind of news updates that I have to click through to get to the open/close button. and it loses sync and needs to restarted all the time. constantly demanding that I link it to my amazon account. it really is dystopian

They've figured out a way to monetize garage doors. I agree with you, it is absolutely horrible.

They regularly break third party (unapproved) clients too. At the moment, pymyq and home assistant are broken.

Re: Philips Hue will soon force users to create an account

#264

For iOS/Apple users just use the bulbs through the Home app. I don’t think I’ve used the Hue app in at least a couple of years since configuring that. Fuck Phillips. Won’t be buying any more of their products.

I don’t think you can have dynamic lighting that slowly changes the color of the lights with just the Home app.

You can, Homekit call it "Adaptive Lighting". It's not as flexible though, you just turn it on and Apple does what it wants - there's no variables you can fiddle with if you don't like what its doing.

Re: Philips Hue will soon force users to create an account

#265

And next you'll have a subscription to indoor lighting. What can be turned into a subscription next! I can't wait to find out. Maybe I'll become a survivalist who builds his own lightbulbs, computers, etc. Once I figure the off-grid lifestyle out, maybe I can launch a paid newsletter about it...

You have already turned your lights on 80 times in the last 30 day period. To continue turning on your lights, please visit our website to upgrade to one of our premium packages with enhanced light-cycle options. In the meantime, your home lighting will stay in enhanced darkness mode for your comfourt and convenience. Thank you, and have a nice day.

Your health and safety is our number one priority.

Re: Philips Hue will soon force users to create an account

#267

Mitigation: If using Zigbee bulbs, 1. get rid of the Philips app (not the bulbs). 2. Replace the Philips Hue bridge (hub) with a RasPi or NUC computer. 3. Connect a Zigbee/Z-Wave combo USB radio dongle. 4. Load Home Assistant OS. This solution not only replaces the Philips locked system, but it can replace (or take over) Amazon, Google, Apple, Ikea and more, simultaneously . About 2551 more. Home Assistant is not per…

> 3. Connect a Zigbee/Z-Wave combo USB radio dongle. Can you recommend a dongle?

I use a SoundOff USB dongle, works great with HA. I recommend against WiFi Zigbee coordinators, they suck.

Re: Philips Hue will soon force users to create an account

#268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fortunately all of their lights work over a standard Zigbee connection. No need for a Hue Hub or App at all. I was already transitioning my lights from using the Hue Hub/App to directly connecting via Zigbee/HomeAssistant before this was announced.

you still need a hub for zigbee connectivity right?

Yes but there are USB Zigbee dangles that will serve this need. You don't need another box and power supply, there are multiple brands to choose from, and no cloud account or goddamn SMS confirmation needed.

Re: Philips Hue will soon force users to create an account

#269
post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am actually looking for a wallmount garage door opener right now. While they do have myq-whatever cloud thing, my understanding is that it's optional. It should be possible to connect an ESP32 or the Konnected sensor thing which will pretend to be a wall button from the opener perspective. Could probably even stick it into a Faraday cage to prevent Amazon sidewalk scenario. Is that not really an option?

A lot of newer garage door openers, especially Chamberlain, don't use simple contact switches on the wall any more. Hacking the remote in this way is still possible by disassembling the wall remote and simulating the button press itself, but it is a lot trickier than with simpler garage doors. And myq cloud is horrible and worth avoiding. They used to have a homekit bridge, but they discontinued it.

Do you know if there's any non-myq jackshaft openers on the market?

Re: Philips Hue will soon force users to create an account

#270
post #237

The older I get the more I de-value "smart" things. I love dumb things. Lightbulb must be dumb. Incandescent lightbulbs were a direct evolution of candles and gas lamps leveraging on simple physical laws and principles. They were not very effective turning most of the energy into heat and LED light bulbs must have been great. But they bring electronics and multiply complexity. I already cannot just simply get a light…

I tend to agree but there are use cases where the smart bulbs have been great for us. 1. Next to our bed we have reading lamp sconces. The sconces we picked out do not have light switches (oops). It turned out to be a blessing in disguise as now the reading lamps automatically switch on in the evening before we come upstairs to bed, then turn off as part of the “good night” scene (which also alarms the security syste…

Yea, that's mostly where I am on this too.

Primary lighting is dumb and controlled by switches.

Secondary lighting/mood lighting is smart and has the ability to be color changed and timing controlled.

That said, 'smart' systems love to lose connection or their settings and do the wrong thing too frequently.

Post reply on HN