Earlier quoted context omitted.
Do states ? (edit - oops, see correction below) There's nothing in this law that would unban TikTok if its ownership were transferred to a US corporation.
As I understand it, nope. States can't negotiate treaties on the US' behalf. Commerce and sanctions would fall under that as I understand it. States also can't regulate interstate trade, which I believe trying to penalize Apple and Google would constitute, since neither has a office in Montana.
TikTok is now banned in Montana
261–270 of 585 posts
Re: TikTok is now banned in Montana
#262Earlier quoted context omitted.
Nukes are a reason why China won't go to war with the US, same as Russia. Unfortunately for Ukraine, they gave up their nukes.
Taiwan lacks nukes and China is rapidly building out it's nuclear umbrella. I believe they absolutely intend to try to use that same nuclear threat to enable their invasion of Taiwan without American intervention.
Re: TikTok is now banned in Montana
#263Earlier quoted context omitted.
That the US is illegally spying on its own citizens is bad, but not as bad as allowing an explicitly hostile, autocratic foreign power to turn a massive propaganda and surveillance platform on US citizens. The US has many problems, but I'd still rather live in its admittedly somewhat rough approximation to transparent liberal democracy than under a completely and explicitly unaccountable regime like the Chinese Commu…
The US has the grasp and reach to punish me based on things about my privately generated data. The CCP has the grasp but not the reach. They are entirely different threat models. Neither one is excusable, but the US spying on me is a lot more immediately applicable. Also I find it funny to the point of parody that China is the country under an unaccountable regime when they are signatories to the Hague System. The Un…
CCP has extraterritorial police stations that regularly surveil the Chinese diaspora and have sent agents to assault individuals. It's particularly bad for expats with domestic families, expats are known to be challenged or coerced using the threat of harm to family members. It's especially bad for uighur and tibetan expats.
Here's the thing. The US has certainly done bad shit. By and large it reckons with it and is subject to corrective action. And we see the effects of that: The current administration (so far) and the previous administration have not started wars in any new countries. Libya was less bad than Iraq was less bad than Vietnam. The direction of us policy is getting better. The direction of Chinese foreign policy is getting worse and their domestic policy is trending genocidal, and there is limited internal dialogue and thus less of a forcing function for amelioration (Hard to make that comparison since CR policies killed millions more than genocide, albeit indiscriminately)
> I hope one day people can look at their own governments more critically
Yes, I hope that one day too, Chinese citizens can look at their country in as critical a way as us citizens can.
Re: TikTok is now banned in Montana
#264Earlier quoted context omitted.
From the Constitution: > Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances. There is nothing there that explicitly grants private enterprises the right to store, sell, and manipulate your free speec…
>There is nothing there that explicitly grants private enterprises the right to store, sell, and manipulate your free speech. ... because the Constitution limits the government. It doesn't grant rights to private enterprise or the people (of which private enterprise is a superset.) Note the Ninth and Tenth Amendments, which explicitly state that the rights listed in the Constitution are not exhaustive, and that all s…
That’s wrong on the Ninth and Tenth: the Ninth Amendment says that enumerated rights don’t limit other rights of the people that exist (the purpose of this was that the Constitution wasn’t a “blank slate” document, there was law existing before it which established rights, and Ninth Amendment was to make clear that the Constitution did not extinguish them, it doesn’t give anything at all to states; the Tenth Amendment, which does address states, says all powers (not rights) not granted to the federal government by the Constitution are reserved to the states or the people.
> So the right of private enterprise to store, sell and “manipulate your free speech” (which is just a bad faith framing of moderation as a violation of civil rights) is implicit to the right of free speech itself
No the right to conduct commerce that relies on doing this is not inherent in either the First Amendment nor is such conduct of commerce, insofar as it has an interstate character, protected from federal regulation by the 9th and 10th Amendments, because regulating interstate commerce is an explicit power of Congress.
Re: TikTok is now banned in Montana
#265Earlier quoted context omitted.
There are often a lot of weasel words used instead. In US Defense circles China has been described as a "pacing threat" over the past few years: https://www.defense.gov/News/News-Stories/Article/Article/26... I guess that's one way to describe the tense rivalry without completely calling your most important trade partner an "adversary".
How is China the most important? Measured in dollars, a brief search seems to show that we trade more with Canada? https://www.census.gov/foreign-trade/statistics/highlights/t...
Re: TikTok is now banned in Montana
#266Earlier quoted context omitted.
"the People's Republic of China is an adversary of the United States" - sent from my iPhone
They threaten regularly to go to war with us over Taiwan. People before WW1 thought war was impossible thanks to how the economy was so interconnected. Russia invaded Ukraine despite how tied they were to Europe economically. To suggest China can't be an adversary just because we trade is a blunder made many times in history, and it fails, time and time again. Don't fall for it.
That is not why everybody thought war was impossible. The reason they thought war was impossible was the King of England, the Kaiser of Germany, and the Tsar of Russia, i.e. the major belligerents in WWI, were all cousins. They were Queen Victoria's grandchildren. Those weren't the only grandchildren on the throne who ended up taking up arms and entering the war. Given how a total of seven of the belligerents were related, including the 3 largest belligerents, nobody thought the family would go to war with one another.
They thought wrong.
Re: TikTok is now banned in Montana
#267Earlier quoted context omitted.
They threaten regularly to go to war with us over Taiwan. People before WW1 thought war was impossible thanks to how the economy was so interconnected. Russia invaded Ukraine despite how tied they were to Europe economically. To suggest China can't be an adversary just because we trade is a blunder made many times in history, and it fails, time and time again. Don't fall for it.
No one is saying that China can't be an adversary. People are saying that maybe US politicians shouldn't be blatantly labeling them as an adversary just to score some sinophobic rageporn points with Fox News viewers.
Re: TikTok is now banned in Montana
#268Earlier quoted context omitted.
Gonna back this up, from the security research I’ve read the app *uploads* over 2gb of data once installed over the course of one month, without any interaction at all from the user.
What is the data? Doesn't iOS limit access to anything outside of the app? It has to ask to access contacts, photos, location. If you just use it to scroll through stupid videos, what does it even have access to?
Re: TikTok is now banned in Montana
#269What if Apple protests and just disables their store in MT? It would only impact at _most_ 500k people (population 1mm at 50% market share, not accounting for demographics)
A huge number of angry Montanians who might vote their representatives out, but a rounding error for Apple.
Re: TikTok is now banned in Montana
#270Earlier quoted context omitted.
Seems like a little bit of a strawman, they're all bad.
Maybe i am misunderstanding. Are you saying that a CCP controlled social media company is as bad to America as an Elon Musk controlled social media company?