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Amazon employees push CEO Andy Jassy to drop return-to-office mandate

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Re: Amazon employees push CEO Andy Jassy to drop return-to-office mandate

#261

Post by x86x87 »

lightbendover wrote: post #234
CobrastanJorji wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Amazon's case, it might not be theater. Amazon owns around a dozen skyscrapers in downtown Seattle. Amazon has a massive number of employees in downtown Seattle, and whether those people are downtown or not makes a significant difference to the real estate values in downtown Seattle. Making their employees come into the office may in fact mean a significant financial reward to Amazon, but not because the employees…

Amazon looked deep into the crystal ball, got a shit response from it, and made a colossal one-way door blunder that will ultimately sink the company as they will not remain competitive with younger hungrier actually-day-one companies and embrace modern workplace trends. If I am forced back into the office, I will simply quit and never even consider working at this place again. Everyone is replaceable and I’m no exce…

they'll make an exception for you and higher level drones.

Re: Amazon employees push CEO Andy Jassy to drop return-to-office mandate

#262

Post by whoisthemachine »

x86x87 wrote: post #17
whoisthemachine wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not certain about that, but I do think companies believe this is a simple way to kill two birds with one stone: 1. Trim headcount. 2. Keep the most "loyal" employees (or those who need the job the most and will say yes to anything, which is a double-sided sword).

haha. Because loyal == high performing. That is how it works. There is absolutely no way that high performing employees that can get a job by crossing the street will ever think about jumping ship because of the shitty manner they are treated.

They may not be after high performing right now, they may just want the ones who won't or can't cross the street.

Re: Amazon employees push CEO Andy Jassy to drop return-to-office mandate

#263

Post by x86x87 »

deschutes wrote: post #206

Many made expensive decisions assuming remote work would become the norm. My guess is there is a large overlap between the bristling crowd and expensive decisions crowd. Sure remote work is good for many experienced individual tech workers but bad for basically everyone else including the company and the communities remote workers have moved to. The pro remote arguments reek of motivated reasoning. It is especially h…

yeah. fuck those entitled prick for expecting work to be financially beneficial for them /s they should be glad to have a job and stop complaining.

Re: Amazon employees push CEO Andy Jassy to drop return-to-office mandate

#264

Post by x86x87 »

dhfbshfbu4u3 wrote: post #99

It’s another layoff really. Just less expensive. Some people will leave for whatever reason. Then, when the cycle completes Amazon will go full RTO. I’m betting it will happen by the start of Q4.

or... the brain drain begins and is so serious that Amazon cancels this whole RTO charade. it could go either way. one thing is for sure: it's not going to be 3 days. that's just something that acts as a throttle so people that are on the edge stay hoping that it's only 3 days.

Re: Amazon employees push CEO Andy Jassy to drop return-to-office mandate

#265

Post by x86x87 »

npalli wrote: post #146

Amazon has over 1.4 Million employees. Looking at this article, 14,000 joined a slack channel to complain. So only about 1% is pushing Andy Jassy about this. Should we assume the remainder (~99%) is OK? If so, this is yet another instance of a small group of people strategically using regular/social media to amplify a minority position which the majority doesn't support.

from people that [still] work there it's 22k at the end of today

Re: Amazon employees push CEO Andy Jassy to drop return-to-office mandate

#266

Post by theonlybutlet »

kcplate wrote: post #237
theonlybutlet wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The opposite is true. Employees are the ones ultimately doing the work and know what value they add. As they see it, they'd have to make outsized sacrifices to return to the office. Businesses have not provided any compelling reason to come back to the office, the actual workers doing the work know how little value it adds to their own stand-alone job. Raising the subject of maintaining remote work rather than pursui…

Employees often have a pretty inflated understanding of how much value they truly provide an organization. Your only slightly more valuable than your replacement sitting in the wings, and only then it’s for a relatively short period of time. Employees need to be providing the compelling reason to the company about why WFH is better.

Despite what you think, a happy worker is a productive worker. Also people tend to look for meaning and purpose in their day to day job. Naturally they're going to be upset, when they're asked to do something that does not help them do the job, inconveniences their lives outside work and contradictorily goes against a fundamental principle of working, being productive.

Re: Amazon employees push CEO Andy Jassy to drop return-to-office mandate

#268

Post by dhfbshfbu4u3 »

x86x87 wrote: post #264
dhfbshfbu4u3 wrote: post #99

It’s another layoff really. Just less expensive. Some people will leave for whatever reason. Then, when the cycle completes Amazon will go full RTO. I’m betting it will happen by the start of Q4.

or... the brain drain begins and is so serious that Amazon cancels this whole RTO charade. it could go either way. one thing is for sure: it's not going to be 3 days. that's just something that acts as a throttle so people that are on the edge stay hoping that it's only 3 days.

I think the brain drain scenario is highly unlikely. Maybe before the bottom fell out on the stock price and maybe before the latest industry layoffs. But now? Most people will go back to the office.

Re: Amazon employees push CEO Andy Jassy to drop return-to-office mandate

#269

Post by kcplate »

theonlybutlet wrote: post #266
kcplate wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Employees often have a pretty inflated understanding of how much value they truly provide an organization. Your only slightly more valuable than your replacement sitting in the wings, and only then it’s for a relatively short period of time. Employees need to be providing the compelling reason to the company about why WFH is better.

Despite what you think, a happy worker is a productive worker. Also people tend to look for meaning and purpose in their day to day job. Naturally they're going to be upset, when they're asked to do something that does not help them do the job, inconveniences their lives outside work and contradictorily goes against a fundamental principle of working, being productive.

The problem tech workers have in the the whole WFH vs RTO debate is that the worker is not arguing from a position of strength. There is a long history behind productive in office work for tech and a short history behind remote work for tech. Whatever productivity gains the worker perceives WFH gives them are either not measurable, not large enough to be noticed by the employer, or not worth other considerations and challenges the employer has to contend with.

For example, if some positions within the organization cannot be performed remotely—as an employer, do I still single out one class of worker to provide a perceived benefit for what may or may not amount to a minor productivity perception gain generally only noticed by the employee? Sure that group is marginally happier, but given time and distance between the WFH and RTO, will the employees just return to the new normal? Usually. However, if I give in and allow WFH do I create a morale problem among other workers who do not have access to that benefit just to kowtow to a group of employees that may (or more likely may not) leave but could be replaced quite easily by equivalent people who do not make that demand?

Re: Amazon employees push CEO Andy Jassy to drop return-to-office mandate

#270

Post by x86x87 »

dhfbshfbu4u3 wrote: post #268
x86x87 wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

or... the brain drain begins and is so serious that Amazon cancels this whole RTO charade. it could go either way. one thing is for sure: it's not going to be 3 days. that's just something that acts as a throttle so people that are on the edge stay hoping that it's only 3 days.

I think the brain drain scenario is highly unlikely. Maybe before the bottom fell out on the stock price and maybe before the latest industry layoffs. But now? Most people will go back to the office.

Hah. People are not goldfish. They will remember and will jumo ship given a better opportunity. One does simply not forget the flexibility WFH brings.
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