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Don't ignore the janitor

happychasing.substack.com

261–270 of 286 posts

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#261

I ignore the janitor because of the obvious wealth disparity between us. He works just as hard as me but is doing a job nobody likes and is paid less for it. It's completely unfair. And when I just see the janitor it's all I think about. This article is like, be nice to the people you step on. Yeah. I don't disagree with that sentiment.

About your flagged child comment: you are stating as fact you know how others think - you are wrong and even worse, you are rude. Are you assuming that others think like you do? Take care: I think your attitude is likely to result in strongly negative effects in your life. Also, please follow the HN guidelines - the guidelines were created to help encourage intelligent discussion. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsgui…

Think about it. Is your comment where you call me rude encouraging intelligent discussion? No.

My comment wasn't flagged. I wasn't rude. I just have a different opinion then you. And you are misinterpreting that difference in opinion as rude.

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not insulting the janitor. I'm insulting myself. And you. And everyone else who works at the company who steps on him. I'm saying, that a "hi" and a smile is utter bullshit. We all know we're stepping on him and a "hi" and a "smile" is opium to make us feel better about ourselves. You completely misinterpreted the post.

I think ignoring someone because you're embarrassed by them is only marginally better than ignoring someone because you think you're better than them. A smile and a nod are free.

Marginally. And obvious. We don't need an article to tell us the basics about how to be decent people. The article wasn't written to tell engineers obvious things that we all already know and likely do.

It was written to make us feel better about ourselves. "Be nice to poor people" is a better title for this article.

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I'm saying everyone including you participates in this fake BS. As if being nice to the janitor solves the fundamental problem. It just covers it up. Are you're saying that unless other folks make as much money as you do, they should not be treated with simple human respect, because doing so points up the inequality in our society? Wow. Being kind to the folks around you has nothing to do with wealth/income inequali…

>Are you're saying that unless other folks make as much money as you do, they should not be treated with simple human respect, because doing so points up the inequality in our society? Are you putting words in my mouth? Wow. Being kind to folks is basic knowledge. Everyone knows it. The article is obvious. It's not telling anyone anything new. Why was such an obvious article written? For what purpose. Certainly not t…

>>Are you're saying that unless other folks make as much money as you do, they should not be treated with simple human respect, because doing so points up the inequality in our society?

>Are you putting words in my mouth?

No. Note the question mark at the end of the sentence. That means (as apparently you are unaware) it's a question, not a statement.

That was the impression I got from your comment. Apparently, I misunderstood your point (and if so, I'm not sure what your point was. Perhaps you could elucidate?). My apologies.

>Being kind to folks is basic knowledge. Everyone knows it. The article is obvious. It's not telling anyone anything new. Why was such an obvious article written? For what purpose. Certainly not to teach engineers to be nice to poor people. That's obvious... no need to teach them.

It should be basic, but it isn't. And more's the pity.

I didn't read (nor do I intend to) the article.

I have no idea why an article I didn't write (or read, for that matter) was written. Perhaps that's something you might ask the author.

>It was written to make you feel better about yourself and your relative position to the people you step on everyday when they clean your toilet because you can't clean it yourself.

If you say so. But as I didn't read the article, it doesn't make me feel anything.

I'd add that I'm kind and polite to people not because they have something I want, but because I respect other humans and myself.

>>I'm not telling you what to do, think or say, but I hope i never meet you.

>How ironic. Being kind is basic knowledge. Yet you say something like this while purporting to be kind... even though it's quite obvious we are unlikely to ever meet. Why waste energy to say something we both know? Why did you say something so obvious?

Because your comment appeared to not only demean those who clean up after you, but also to beat up on others because you think that being kind to such folks isn't sincere.

It's been my experience (I'm more than half a century old) that when folks ascribe motivations to other people, that reflects the motivations of the speaker rather than the recipient.

As such, I can only assume that you feel that way. I don't want to interact with folks like that. Hence my statement.

I didn't say that to be mean, as I have no interest or stake in your personal emotional state.

Rather, I said it because I don't want to be around folks who present themselves as the only arbiters of other peoples' motivations and feelings.

>You said it to be mean. While pretending not to be mean. Why? Because it makes you feel better.

Your assertion doesn't make it true. I don't need to make others feel bad (or have others make me feel good) to feel good about myself.

I try to live my life as a decent, kind person. I don't always succeed, but I do my best. And that's enough for me.

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#264
This isn't about janitors or even service workers.

It's about ignoring the humanity around us.

Yes, we're all tasked at work, and have limited bandwidth and interest.

But still: prioritizing kindness make the world a better place for everyone, because it's a way of shouting quietly: I am not a tool, and neither are you.

This applies to how developers treat QA, or marketers treat developers, leads and newbies, etc. Because that's where it seems my task involves getting you to deliver.

Instead, help others feel respected, and want to do their job, instead of having to do their job. Don't be surprised if they don't: it's their choice.

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#265
post #171
post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you arguing it is condescending to say hi to custodial staff?

The way I read it they're arguing both that it's condescending to think that they need to be told to say hi to custodial staff, and that the custodial staff might find it condescending for someone to hold a door. One of the interesting things I've found while travelling is the different forms of interaction with customer service, hospitality, custodial staff. US tends to have a 'customer is always right' sickly sweet…

[deleted]

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#266
post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ... it means that even when I do say hello or hold a door or whatever I don't get a response. I'm sure they find it condescending. This whole post is kind of condescending TBH.

Are you arguing it is condescending to say hi to custodial staff?

I'm arguing treating "custodial staff" as some distinct group that deserves special treatment, in deep need of your smiles and door holding is condescending. The tone of the original article and this reply came across like the authors think they're somehow above the "custodial staff". Like they are lords talking about the peasantry.

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#267
These type of articles are always cringy. Essentially: "low social IQ tech type discovers other people, suggests we talk to humans since they seem to like it".

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is why, of all the schools I've gone to, LA City College remains the hardest, even after later graduating from a top ten engineering school. I was originally a biology major, and with Los Angeles flooded with refugees and immigrants, a whole lot of medical doctors and research scientists from former Soviet republics found themselves in a country where their licenses and degrees were not accepted, and they had to…

Isn't that a temporary thing though? I assume anyone that was going to come from the former Soviet republic has already come by now?

If really really smart immigrants stop coming to America, the country will be in deep shit, IMO. Per your question: they don't have to be from Soviet countries, just with qualifications that aren't accepted at face value.

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think ignoring someone because you're embarrassed by them is only marginally better than ignoring someone because you think you're better than them. A smile and a nod are free.

Marginally. And obvious. We don't need an article to tell us the basics about how to be decent people. The article wasn't written to tell engineers obvious things that we all already know and likely do. It was written to make us feel better about ourselves. "Be nice to poor people" is a better title for this article.

Ok, so why do you find being nice to poor people so difficult?

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#270
post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I take this type of mindset often. It's something I'm trying to change. The better mindset, in my opinion, is that you can choose to do something nice for others for no reason other than to help someone else out.

The point I was making is that someone else's job isn't being nice to them, because you aren't doing something nice FOR THEM you are instead doing something nice FOR THEIR EMPLOYER as the amount of money they are paid or the load of tasks they are being given will adjust behind the scenes. It isn't intuitive, but once pointed out I hope it becomes obvious? If you do enough of their job for them, they get fired :(. If…

Again, where did this meme about 'doing someone elses job'? The point made was, be respectful of them when they're doing their job, by cooperating and not winging about it.

This has become a tortuous argument which on the surface seems to be for justifying being disrespectful or lazy.

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