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EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

macrumors.com

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Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#261

Post by pchristensen »

eklavya wrote: post #197
oellegaard wrote: post #191

It's fun how Android users are so excited on behalf of Apple users in terms of letting Apple users install custom apps from outside the App Store. Being an Apple user for more than 15 years, I couldn't be more happy with the fact that Apple has vetted the applications you find in App Store. Also, naturally, App Developers are excited. Well, perhaps you should think about the users - we don't care about you having to…

Exclusively Apple user here, couldn’t be more happier for the announcement. Keeps my favoured platform alive and innovative. Btw, you can keep using App Store so I don’t understand the issue here.

With sideloading, developers with market power will be able to force iOS users into worse conditions than the standard App Store. You can bet that FB will get everyone onto their sideloaded version ASAP, and I doubt it will respect the "Ask App Not to Track Me". Then, once everyone has figured out sideloading with FB, the bar will be lower for other apps and suddenly the consumer protections of the App Store are weaker for everyone.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#262

Post by cycomanic »

jahewson wrote: post #232
enragedcacti wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They aren't a payment processor, they are a payment provider . You are correct that most banks have deals with Apple and thus cards are available, but Paypal, Venmo, Cashapp, Google Pay, etc. can't be used as a default payment provider for purchases on the iPhone. Apple reportedly makes about 0.15% of each purchase through Apple Pay[1]. [1] http://www.macrumors.com/2014/09/12/more-apple-pay-details/

Of course they can’t, because they’re not credit/debit cards. What’s the PoS going to do with a PayPal NFC? Nothing. It’s like complaining they don’t support bitcoin - neither do the stores!

There are lots of payment services that are not credit/debit cards and are widely used (swish in Sweden is another one). All these cannot use NFC on IOS.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#263

Post by efields »

annexrichmond wrote: post #250
efields wrote: post #243

Let’s start the list of UX that could be built if apple followed these rules starting tomorrow. What will be available to me that I don’t have now, and how will it benefit me, Joe P. Consumer? Keep in mind, I have no idea what a software developer does all day — I just want my email to work and these internet pop ups to be easier to close. What am I missing out on?

It may allow for some healthy competition and ultimately better UX on that front in the long term, but in the short term it could also take away dev time for Apple to improve iOS in other ways.

That’s a good point about Apple’s own resource reallocation necessary in the short term. iOS feels _pretty good_ these days compared to where it was not too long ago, but having to “unlock” APIs that were built to be private but now have to be public will also expose new bugs (both inherent and new).

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#264

Post by rootusrootus »

_the_inflator wrote: post #120
superb-owl wrote: post #5

This is huge. Forcing Apple to allow app side-loading, third-party payments, etc is going to wrest away control of the iOS ecosystem (and eat pretty heavily into their revenues [1] [1] https://www.cnbc.com/2022/01/10/apple-implies-it-generated-r... I hope some of these regulations spill over into the U.S. and the rest of the world.

Never underestimate the creative genius of Apple. They will come up with new solutions to keep their walled garden. "Allow users to install apps from third-party app stores and sideload directly from the internet" I bet this is going to be a horrible user experience. "Are you really sure?", "Apple takes no responsibility not warranty" whatsoever. What sound usually easy on paper...

I agree, it could be ugly. The GDPR is supposed to be great, but what practical impact did it have on most of us? Cookie consent dialogs everywhere.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#265

Post by filoleg »

eklavya wrote: post #197
oellegaard wrote: post #191

It's fun how Android users are so excited on behalf of Apple users in terms of letting Apple users install custom apps from outside the App Store. Being an Apple user for more than 15 years, I couldn't be more happy with the fact that Apple has vetted the applications you find in App Store. Also, naturally, App Developers are excited. Well, perhaps you should think about the users - we don't care about you having to…

Exclusively Apple user here, couldn’t be more happier for the announcement. Keeps my favoured platform alive and innovative. Btw, you can keep using App Store so I don’t understand the issue here.

>you can keep using app store, so I don't understand the issue

Apps with massive following that are into the idea of violating privacy rights will leave App Store and its restrictions, and will be available only on third party app stores where they can do whatever they want.

Imagine Facebook leaving App Store and becoming available only on Meta Store (or whatever they would call it). Oh, and they dont have to abide by Apple's privacy rules anymore. Oh, and you also got no choice now if you want to continue using it.

I personally don't use FB, but it was a solid example, and it can apply to any other app. Facebook is almost definitely cheering now at this decision, because I remember they had a pretty bad earnings call last year after Apple added additional privacy restrictions to iOS/App Store. But worry no more, FB is back in the game as soon as they can release their unrestricted version on a third party app store.

"More choice available", in this scenario refers not to my personal choices, but to more ways for companies behind those large apps to avoid privacy considerations and restrictions of the platform.

Tl;dr: FB has only two options now - abide by the current privacy rules of App Store or not have an app for iOS at all. With third party app stores being available, FB has a new and way juicier option - publish a version in their own app store with zero restrictions. Why would they even consider the official App Store and follow the restrictions. Consumers lose a solid option here.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#266

Post by orangecat »

the_duke wrote: post #235
ajaimk wrote: post #121

EU regulation just ruins tech in my opinion. GDPR was great in principle but all we ended up with was annoying cookie pop ups. Apple did a much better job with App Tracking Privacy. And not, EU so regulating that to make it worse

The problem with GDPR is underspecification and bad enforcement because the agency of the country where the company is registered is responsible, and the fuzzy nature of the law allows companies to drag out fees with long legal battles. The annoying popups are basically malicious compliance. We'll see how things play out here, but this time there are a lot of provisions that should make enforcement easier.

The annoying popups are basically malicious compliance.

Yes, and this should not have come as a surprise to competent regulators.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#267

Post by VyseofArcadia »

silon42 wrote: post #201
VyseofArcadia wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I sure hope not. As I age, the value prop of consoles is, I don't have to mess with settings or diagnose problems or sacrifice goats to the "did this update break something" gods. It just works. I can just play games.

This was true when consoles were offline only and games on physical media... I'm not investing into newer ones unless they can do the same.

I agree with the sentiment, but in my experience that's just not true. [1] The PS4 and PS5 are nice and pain free. The Switch even more so, because the games will run right off the cartridge without needing updates. They have available updates, but the version shipped on the cartridge is 100% playable.

[1] With the exception of the XBox because Microsoft can't get their shit together.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#269

Post by rootusrootus »

vorpalhex wrote: post #260
chris_st wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see this, and it just makes me think that if they had, we'd be seeing posts that say, "Apple's greed (in maintaining the egregious 10% commission for so long) is going to undermine their entire ecosystem. If Apple moved voluntarily to 5% or 3% for all, ...".

30% is an insane amount.

How does it compare to a regular bricks & mortar retail store? Shelf fees, etc?

Edit: downvoted for asking a question? Thanks HN.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#270

Post by seydor »

pchristensen wrote: post #248
superb-owl wrote: post #5

This is huge. Forcing Apple to allow app side-loading, third-party payments, etc is going to wrest away control of the iOS ecosystem (and eat pretty heavily into their revenues [1] [1] https://www.cnbc.com/2022/01/10/apple-implies-it-generated-r... I hope some of these regulations spill over into the U.S. and the rest of the world.

For many (most?) users, Apple's restrictions, especially sideloading, protect users from bad actor app owners (looking at you, Facebook). To me, allowing sideloading is like allowing chemical weapons to be used in war. Yes, it's a new tool and capability at your disposal, but it's also available to every powerful and unscrupulous participant.

> allowing sideloading is like allowing chemical weapons to be used in war.

yes, it is exactly like that. Millions of people who download .exe to their compuyters every day are doing chemical warfare

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