New California law requires high schools to start later • Hacker News Board

Re: New California law requires high schools to start later

#261

Post by CogitoCogito » Sat, Jul 02, 2022, 5:45 PM UTC

collegeburner wrote: post #237

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There seem to be 3 attitudes to kids: 1 - Adults that get some kind of power trip out of tyrany and justify it by 'toughening them up'. They demand respect and dicipline they never had themselves. They will have endless stories about how their childhood was tough, and they had to talk to school and home 10 miles, alone, thorugh the snow, and it was uphill both ways 2 - Adults that 'care', by helicoptering over kids a…

Quoted post unavailable.

> Discipline matters, kids should be getting in school by 7 AM in school or they will never develop character.

...

> If we let them get up later than the sun that is what will happen.

Where I live, the last day of high school this year was June 10th and the sun rose on that day at 4:27 AM. Is that when students should be getting up? On December 23rd before the Christmas holidays the sun rose at 8:55 AM. Is that when students should be getting up?

Re: New California law requires high schools to start later

#262

Post by least » Sun, Jul 03, 2022, 7:42 PM UTC

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #208

giantg2 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is behaviorally/biologically beneficial varies by individual. Societal life should be a factor as that does factor into the holistic well-being of the student. Not just some myopic rule about start times that negatively impacts everything else (after school activities, jobs, parent schedules, etc). "Schools shouldn't be forcing developing humans into a schedule that impairs their ability to learn and function, n…

> Societal life should be a factor as that does factor into the holistic well-being of the student Not really, tehre seems to be 3 groups of people: 1 - Adults that get some kind of power trip out of tyrany and making kids miserable and justifying it by 'toughening them up'. They deman respect and dicipline while demonstrating total disrespect towards kids and usually have little dicipline themselves. They will have…

I'm not sure I entirely agree with the second point; Adults need not necessarily be helicopter parents and only push their children towards desirable career fields. They can simply be overbearing while supporting their children in what they want to pursue, though this has its own negative consequences tied to it at as well.

Your list also entirely excludes neglectful parents, whose lack of presence and guidance can be of great detriment to their children's progress in life.

I think that there are a lot of parents who might encompass all sorts of different stereotypes as they try to raise their children the best they can. "Toughening up" children is important. Building up resiliency in a controlled and safe environment is necessary for a person to navigate regular life. Showing compassion and interest in your children is important because it allows them to live their most honest selves. Providing structure for children is important because it helps them succeed in a world that very much relies on various constructs.

I think ultimately, parenthood is hard and finding the right balance of things is hard and unfortunately, you can't just undo the mistakes that can have lifelong impact on your children. I don't think my parents raised me the best they could have, but I don't doubt that they definitely tried.

Re: New California law requires high schools to start later

#263

Post by uoaei » Tue, Jul 05, 2022, 8:46 PM UTC

giantg2 wrote: post #10

givemeethekeys wrote: post #4

8:30 or later. Good. I say start it at 10. Let the kids sleep in and be happier for it.

Ten sounds like a nightmare for working parents. Eight seems like a completely reasonable start time to me, yet this law prevents that. Schools should be able to decide for themselves based off of the parents and what works for those in the district.

Plenty of things "should" happen but the systemic problem that if solved would alleviate these issues is to make sure people live near enough to good schools to elide the need for driving children to school in the first place.

Re: New California law requires high schools to start later

#264

Post by robswc » Fri, Jul 08, 2022, 2:21 AM UTC

ravitation wrote: post #163

robswc wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was one of those kids. Only because taking the bus was a pain in the ass and my parents loved me enough to put up with it, at least until I could drive. Bus was awful. Kids had no respect for the driver or other kids. Plus it easily tripled the commute time.

> Bus was awful. Exactly. Similar to the problem many adults have trying to get to work by bus, it often doubles or triples a commute time.

Yep. I'm all for people choosing their transit... but even if I'm not driving, 3x-ing the commute just isn't something I could do.

Re: New California law requires high schools to start later

#265

Post by _trackno5 » Fri, Jul 08, 2022, 8:42 AM UTC

sharadov wrote: post #231

_trackno5 wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This argument makes no sense to me. How is it criminal to start at 7:50am? Kids can sleep early and get their 8-10 hours of sleep just the same.

But they don't - screens being a major culprit.

That's their own and their parents fault though.

Re: New California law requires high schools to start later

#266

Post by throwaway2016a » Wed, Jul 13, 2022, 8:23 PM UTC

pc86 wrote: post #227

WalterBright wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 13 or older Jeez, we've really infantilized our kids.

What's infantilizing about recognizing that most people attending high school are 13 or older?

Really late reply but exactly this. I said 13 because this was an article about highschool, which for most people starts at 13.

Though, with that said, I don't know what is the youngest age I could generalize it with. Depends so much on the maturity of the child and also how far where you live is from the bus stop. But I think it is safe to say that age is equal to or less than 13.

Re: New California law requires high schools to start later

#267

Post by [deleted] » Wed, Jul 13, 2022, 8:32 PM UTC

jghn wrote: post #189

throwaway2016a wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While as a parent myself I agree but this is high school. Generally speaking someone who's 13 or older should be able to make their way onto a bus without an adult. When I was that age (granted this was the 90s) I had a key to the house and was trusted to let myself in when I got back. What's worse is the end of day. My kid is younger and I need to be at the bus stop at 3:50 PM every day to meet her.

I walked by myself a quarter mile to kindergarten. I walked by myself to a bus stop through the rest of my school days until myself & friends started driving. Most of those years I came home to an empty house at the end of the school day. Not sure why this is a big deal. Kids can manage on their own.

[deleted]