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Enclave: An Unpickable Lock

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Re: Enclave: An Unpickable Lock

#261

Post by retcon »

eszaq wrote: post #219
timhh wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only one I've seen was the Bowley lock. But yeah I sent my unpickable lock to him and he never mentioned it. :( https://youtu.be/7hUonUE1hEY

Nice vid! You can print one of these for just 30 GBP? You know high end locks go for a lot more than that right? You could be printing money!

Yep the nice Abloy ones go for over three hundred livres Anglais.

But nobody is going to buy a single thing that the insurers haven't approved.

https://www.guardiansecuritysystems.co.uk/abloy-protec2-pl36...

Re: Enclave: An Unpickable Lock

#262

Post by matthewfcarlson »

nynx wrote: post #100
swighton wrote: post #44

Interesting design. I made a lock a couple years ago that is quite similar in principle (though this design is different and has a couple nice improvements). https://youtu.be/_7vPNcnYWQ4 One of my main goals is to be an inspiration, though if it was based by my design I wish they’d credit it. Especially since they’re patenting it.

It’s so cool that you’re on HN! I’m a huge fan of your work and it helped me feel comfortable with aiming to be a generalist.

Agreed. I’m a firmware engineer and a writer for Hackaday and the Stuff Made Here videos are throughly enjoyed by both crowds.

Re: Enclave: An Unpickable Lock

#263

Post by trompetenaccoun »

orthoxerox wrote: post #174
trompetenaccoun wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Didn't know HN had so many lock experts and lawyers frequenting the site. Dozens of comments have already detected an IP violation, half the thread is recommending ways the lock can be tested or people it needs to be sent to for confirmation of the unpickable claim... As someone who doesn't know anything about lockpicking, I feel like part of a weird minority here. What do I know but I'd assumed one would take it to…

That youtuber has won his fair share of locksport competitions.

Sure. Not saying he's bad at lockpicking. The point is more are you an expert yourself or how do you know he's THE guy to talk to? For reference, what are the main lock picking competitions in the world and which ones has he won? Can you name them?

When I looked it up out of interest, he isn't mentioned as the world expert in actual lockpicking forums. I found a couple of other names but in any way, it makes more sense to have it tested by a group of experts than just a single person. One person may fail, but if an entire convention full of the best lockpickers can't pick your lock, that's a much better indication the lock really is unpickable.

Re: Enclave: An Unpickable Lock

#264

Post by MattRix »

cvccvroomvroom wrote: post #204
harrisi wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The interaction of engineering and "use" by the Lock Picking Lawyer ( https://youtu.be/Ecy1FBdCRbQ ) was fascinating - "use" here really meaning "exploiting". It's a problem many here are aware of, either by over-engineering things intended for use by non-engineers, or designing things to be used by customers when the designer isn't intimately familiar with the use. In this case it was sort of somewhere in between. I…

I can't be bothered to use YT anymore with all the ads. They're basically interactive, on-demand, corporate TV monetizing other people's content and nothing more. The world needs a co-op video sharing app and a microblogging app.

You could also just pay for YouTube premium. I subscribed about a year ago and I don’t regret it.

Re: Enclave: An Unpickable Lock

#265

Post by pengaru »

pwg wrote: post #245
cvccvroomvroom wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't be bothered to use YT anymore with all the ads. They're basically interactive, on-demand, corporate TV monetizing other people's content and nothing more. The world needs a co-op video sharing app and a microblogging app.

Just download the videos you want to watch: https://github.com/yt-dlp/yt-dlp The only "ads" you get will be the ones the video uploaders encode directly into the video itself. Plus you can watch using whatever playback software works best on your system, instead of the rather feature free JS player youtube provides.

This is the only way to enjoy youtube without a premium account, and even with a premium account it's still far better to use a proper player like mpv.

But it seems likely to me that YouTube will eventually start embedding the ads more inextricably into the video streams while downloaded. Especially as more people use tools like youtube-dl/yt-dlp to circumvent ads.

Re: Enclave: An Unpickable Lock

#266

Post by adrianmonk »

> Each position in this lock has a bottom pin, five thin master pins, and a special top pin.

In case anyone else struggled with this phrasing, it means the five master pins are thin like pancakes.

I initially assumed thin like drinking straws, which was impossible to reconcile with the photo.

Re: Enclave: An Unpickable Lock

#267

Post by IIAOPSW »

This isn't unpickable at all, its just remarkably tedious to do so. The fundamental information leak via how far you can turn before getting stuck is still there. You've just added a mechanism that temporarily locks-in the current key-state being tested, forcing an attacker to return to the initial position before inputting the next key-state. Don't get me wrong, that is a good design feature. But what you have made is still very much in pickable via the same old established principles of lockpicking. You have simply forced the standard technique to be more clumsy and error prone to execute, perhaps requiring some unique tool to measure the subtle differences that give the key away.

Re: Enclave: An Unpickable Lock

#268

Post by jamiek88 »

sverhagen wrote: post #201
TrumpRapedWomen wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He can't pick the Abloy Protect2 lock. Less than 10 people in the world can pick it actually.

On its surface, that sounds like a weird claim to make. Even if people would always advertise their ability to pick it, how would you have such an accurate count?

That’s like the old ‘only three people in the world can understand general relativity’.

Re: Enclave: An Unpickable Lock

#269

Post by swighton »

sixQuarks wrote: post #222
swighton wrote: post #44

Interesting design. I made a lock a couple years ago that is quite similar in principle (though this design is different and has a couple nice improvements). https://youtu.be/_7vPNcnYWQ4 One of my main goals is to be an inspiration, though if it was based by my design I wish they’d credit it. Especially since they’re patenting it.

As others have already said, you’re a huge inspiration. I was trying to find interviews that you’ve done to learn more about how you came To know so much, but it looks like you’ve never really done any interviews. Any reason why?

I’m not all that interested in advancing my personal prominence. This is why I originally didn’t even show myself in the videos

Re: Enclave: An Unpickable Lock

#270

Post by IIAOPSW »

infogulch wrote: post #32
Cyclical wrote: post #13

While very cool and seemingly well-designed, this seems like a derivative of the lock developed by the YouTuber StuffMadeHere. A little strange to see someone applying for a patent for a version of someone else's design.

The principle is the same, but this design is different and better in some ways. Depending on the generality of the claims a patent may be reasonable. The Enclave design is more refined/compact, but I'm skeptical of the longevity/durability of the wedge mechanism. The underlying principle that's common between the StuffMadeHere and Enclave designs is 1. Decouple setting the pins from testing them, and 2. Do not allow…

Except this isn't a constant time comparison. You still reach the "no more turning" angle at whichever pin is incorrect first. This is more like forcing the password to be fully retyped after each failed attempt. A good feature, but not a feature which eliminates side channels which might be there.
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