have fun staying poor
Web3? I have my DAOts
261–270 of 636 posts
Re: Web3? I have my DAOts
#262I completely agree with the author. I've been reading a lot about the EVM, and while there's some interesting technology involved, it feels unlikely to be able to support any worthwhile applications outside of blockchain finance or moving $ around the world[0] (since the code can really only directly reference the blockchain itself). It's a bit like playing with a programming language in a sandbox that has (1) has no…
> (1) has no I/O functions Input: User identity, money. Output: Digital services, site subscriptions, digital assets, in-game items, NFT's representing real world assets held by trusted companies (wine, event tickets, tokenized securities). None of this requires oracles and exists today. Your mistake is thinking that just because the base layer is decentralised that we're somehow not allowed to connect to companies w…
Let's say everyone on the planet is Ethereum enabled tomorrow. What is the business case for the winery to use it in your example? I get that Ethereum or any other crypto can be another payment option for their customers. Beyond that what use does a winery have for a programmable substrate underlying its transactions with customers or suppliers? I'm not saying there is none but if you're going to rip on HN users, frankly it's hard to parse what this language even means.
Re: Web3? I have my DAOts
#263Earlier quoted context omitted.
Unlike with crypto where the money is always lost forever, mistakes with wires can usually be corrected. If you don’t understand Wires then you may be unaware of this.
My understanding was that wires were quite difficult to reverse, and it's ACH transfers that can be reversed. Regardless, the reversibility aspect has both positives and negatives. It does allow you to reverse transactions, but with the added complexity of the transaction not really settling until after that reversibility period passes. If I receive a crypto transfer (ex: a stablecoin), I can know that the money is a…
The risk of the money being fraudulently taken back is close to zero. If you are worrying about that happening, then you are either a fraudster yourself, or just being paranoid. There is no major benefit to not having this.
On the other hand, if a crypto transaction has any errors, the money is instantly lost forever, and nobody can help you.
There is no upside to that at all.
Re: Web3? I have my DAOts
#264Earlier quoted context omitted.
What's the recovery if your private Ethereum key gets deleted, or worse, stolen? If you're signing in via some other 3rd party, you can change your password. I'm just trying to think of how "Sign in with Ethereum" would work if you're trying to get your technophobic grandma that clicks on phishing links and responds to the County Password Inspectors [0] when they call to use it. [0] https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/…
I think smart wallets will help with that. You’ll be able to create a set of recovery tokens such that you only need a subset of the tokens to recover your wallet. For example, you can generate 7 tokens and only need 5 to reset your wallet keys. You can give 3 to your relatives, 1 in a safe-deposit box, etc. Grandma’s kids can help her set it up. Edit: Or, for people who really prefer centralization, you can give all…
Surprised actually this doesn't exist in a more general sense -- just X of N decryption of arbitrary files. Could be your private key recovery, or just mundane corporate documents with provable "two man rule"
Re: Web3? I have my DAOts
#265RE: Censorship You often see advocates of decentralization hail networks for being pro-immutability, battling censorship. How does it deal with data you absolutely do _NOT_ want to be shared and propagated around? I'm talking about things like CP, terrorist media, fake news, scams/frauds, and what not.
Crypto proponents are in favor of there being no technical restrictions that prevent such content being posted. An interesting possibility is that illegal content gets permanently inserted into a blockchain, which could make running, for example, an ethereum node very illegal.
> Crypto proponents are in favor of there being no technical restrictions that prevent such content being posted
This is precisely why they'll fail (aside from technological issues): the rank and file person on the internet does NOT want a Wild West when they go to visit a news feed. Hell, the average person doesn't even really like curated content. They want a chronological list of things they decide to be relevant and nothing else. Just look at all the complaining every time Instatwitter changes an algorithm and hides the method for sorting by most recent.
And what they don't know yet is that all these big companies, if they use this technology, they're going to use them in very focused ways to reward people and prevent them from abandoning their platforms. Because "free" has many meanings, but none of them are inherently exclusionary from corporate competition.
Re: Web3? I have my DAOts
#266So Web3 is built on blockchains which are decentralized and decentralization confers benefits such as censorship resistance, downtime resistance etc. But blockchains require resources to operate. At great scale they will require great cost. What's to stop powerful actors from leveraging economies of scale and consolidating those resources, then ultimately using their control to manipulate the blockchains themselves?…
The cost in blockchains usually comes from security garuntees, but there's a strong force of resisting centralization in many forms in the blockchain space, e.g. https://vitalik.ca/general/2021/12/06/endgame.html We'll see what the endgame actually is as time inexorably marches on
In that post Vitalik actually says he thinks there's a high chance block production will end up centralized. If it happens, what's to stop the government from going to the dominant block producers and forcing them to impose limits on the kind of data a block can store? Then dragging them to court or enacting some other form of political retribution if they fail to do so.
Re: Web3? I have my DAOts
#267Earlier quoted context omitted.
> (1) has no I/O functions Input: User identity, money. Output: Digital services, site subscriptions, digital assets, in-game items, NFT's representing real world assets held by trusted companies (wine, event tickets, tokenized securities). None of this requires oracles and exists today. Your mistake is thinking that just because the base layer is decentralised that we're somehow not allowed to connect to companies w…
Let's say everyone on the planet is Ethereum enabled tomorrow. What is the business case for the winery to use it in your example? I get that Ethereum or any other crypto can be another payment option for their customers. Beyond that what use does a winery have for a programmable substrate underlying its transactions with customers or suppliers? I'm not saying there is none but if you're going to rip on HN users, fra…
I’ll bite. A winery could sell ownership of wine stored or wine yet to be made. The purchaser, if sold via an NFT, could resell that ownership with no interaction with the winery until claiming the wine at a later date.
This means both parties no longer need any relationship between the initial sale and claiming the eventual goods. The winery will simply be able to wait for someone to return with proof of ownership at a later date.
If the winery gave out certificates or built some app it would need to verify and maintain that. With an NFT there is very little work on their end.
Ultimately this turns these type of products into highly liquid assets. This will greatly increase their value to a potential customer and the initial purchase price. Which will make the winery more money for the wine it sells.
This can effectively be done with anything that can be claimed at a later date after initial purchase.
Re: Web3? I have my DAOts
#268I completely agree with the author. I've been reading a lot about the EVM, and while there's some interesting technology involved, it feels unlikely to be able to support any worthwhile applications outside of blockchain finance or moving $ around the world[0] (since the code can really only directly reference the blockchain itself). It's a bit like playing with a programming language in a sandbox that has (1) has no…
> (1) has no I/O functions Input: User identity, money. Output: Digital services, site subscriptions, digital assets, in-game items, NFT's representing real world assets held by trusted companies (wine, event tickets, tokenized securities). None of this requires oracles and exists today. Your mistake is thinking that just because the base layer is decentralised that we're somehow not allowed to connect to companies w…
> Output: Digital services, site subscriptions, digital assets, in-game items, NFT's representing real world assets held by trusted companies (wine, event tickets, tokenized securities).
> None of this requires oracles and exists today.
While I only mentioned oracles specifically, I should have clarified: I'm referring both to oracles (making queries to external data sources and providing the results to the blockchain), and to external code that interprets data stored on the blockchain and acts on it. I'm not sure if there's a name for it in common use (I'd call it something like a "performer"). Either way, the issue is the same as that with oracles; whatever decentralization or smart contract guarantees you had on the blockchain disappear as soon as you have external code interpreting blockchain data to then make decisions in external systems (digital services, site subscriptions, digital assets, in-game items, NFT's, etc). If oracles provide inputs to the blockchain, these non-blockchain pieces of code provide the real-world outputs.
Example: even if somewhere in the blockchain I can prove that I should own something in the real world, it's still up to your site/service/app/whatever to honor that through external code. If it doesn't honor it, I'm stuck relying on traditional legal means to intervene, just as with any other standard contract. That legal system – as flawed as it is – tends to work for contracts written on the back of a napkin, stored in a SQL database, or coded in a smart contract (though that's probably the most questionable at the moment).
If I'm wrong, please correct me, but I've been interested in this stuff for a while, and I haven't found anything that actually solves the fundamental problem of oracles and the interpretation of blockchain data. That problem is important because it undermines many of the primary selling points of smart contracts.
> Your mistake is thinking that just because the base layer is decentralised that we're somehow not allowed to connect to companies we choose to trust
So, honest question: why care about the base layer being decentralized if in the end, you choose to trust those companies? What did the decentralization do for you in that interaction?
Re: Web3? I have my DAOts
#269Earlier quoted context omitted.
that's how i felt about social networking. People posting their breakfast, ridiculous. Baby pictures, silly. Cat pictures, kids these days. Yet somehow the vanity/reality show is making billions 10 years later
I remember how Hacker News laughed at Facebook during its IPO. Hacker News are also against Google, TikTok, Snap, Instagram all the time. Investing against the popular opinions of Hacker News is an easy way to get rich.
I hope Facebook does not guzzle same amount of energy as Bitcoin.
We don't need another nation level energy guzzler for a spy/disinformation network.
Re: Web3? I have my DAOts
#270Earlier quoted context omitted.
The person you replied to said “crypto” not “Bitcoin”. They can convert their coins to an algorithmic stablecoin and make the payment in a single transaction with no price change.
So is Bitcoin no longer being pushed as a currency? Is that “official”?
Those goalposts got moved years ago