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How to permanently delete your Facebook account

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Re: How to permanently delete your Facebook account

#261

Post by kelnos »

asdff wrote: post #247
shadowfaxRodeo wrote: post #15

I got rid of Facebook, Instagram, and WhatsApp about 4 years ago. Facebook and Instagram was easy, but people who have WhatsApp really think you’re weird for not having it. Deleting WhatsApp, while annoying for me personally, has resulted in many people I know joining Signal or Telegram — the network effect can be broken by being belligerent. If you don’t want to have a conversation about why you deleted WhatsApp, si…

Do you live outside the US? I always hear how popular WhatsApp is on here but honestly I don't know a single person who uses that app in the US. Or any chat platform for that matter. Everyone just texts and calls at least in my younger millenial circle. I guess in other countries they still charge for texts and calls like its 2002 and maybe WhatsApp is more popular there to get around paying for each text message?

I live in the US, and there are 4 or 5 people I talk to via WhatsApp as our primary communications channel. I'm also a member of 2 or 3 group chats that are used occasionally that I get value out of. I managed to move one group chat over to Signal, but the others didn't budge. I also find that WhatsApp is often the go-to for short-term ad-hoc group chats, like for a bunch of people who are on a trip or vacation together.

Re: How to permanently delete your Facebook account

#262

Post by swamp-agr »

trutannus wrote: post #246
swamp-agr wrote: post #47

The situation is quite interesting here. - Imagine, you're living outside of USA/UK/Europe. - Formally, it's possible to proceed with "Permanently delete my account". - You will even receive email assuring you that two weeks later profile would be completely deleted. - Then, couple years later you'll occasionally seen email from facebook that someone tried to log in into your ("permanently deleted") account. - You'll…

This is a bit hyperbolic, and a little unbelievable. Is it possible that you experienced a bug in Facebook? Or that someone else had access to your account, which prevented the deletion? You've essentially asserted that you've caught Facebook lying about the account deletion process, while not showing us any proof outside of your comment. Not located in US/UK/Europe, however my deleted account is fully deleted. Can't…

Yes, it is possible that I experienced a bug at least three times (2010, 2014 and 2020), certainly.

It might be the case, sure.

Last email (as of today) about permanent deletion was one year ago. During next year I will give it another try: log in and come back to you, then.

Re: How to permanently delete your Facebook account

#263

Post by kelnos »

malka wrote: post #31
Traster wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think Amazon is actually a different story to a certain extent. Sure, you can delete your account, but at the end of the day you've transacted with them and they can keep a record of who they've transacted with, right? Personally I think it would be unreasonable for me to demand that a shop I buy from delete the record of who purchased it.

> I think it would be unreasonable for me to demand that a shop I buy from delete the record of who purchased it. Why ? for recent transaction, they need to keep it for tax purposes but they have no legal need to keep old records.

I don't think "need" matters here. They have a record of a transaction, and they want to keep that record. I don't think I have a right to demand that they delete that data.

The GDPR/CCPA/etc. likely has different requirements here, and probably requires deletion after they're no longer needed (for tax purposes or whatever).

But I personally have financial records going back decades, so I can't fault a company for wanting to do the same thing.

Re: How to permanently delete your Facebook account

#264

Post by nobody9999 »

cratermoon wrote: post #244
nobody9999 wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>There's no reason to believe it's a "full" account delete even in the countries covered by the GDPR considering they brazenly breach the GDPR with their "consent" flow. Given FB's business model, and the fact that they create "shadow" profiles for folks who don't even have FB accounts, I have no doubt that while their UI might pretend that your account has been "deleted", all the data still exists for their use. Whi…

> I have no doubt that while their UI might pretend that your account has been "deleted", all the data still exists for their use. They don't even have to pretend to delete your account, they can actually delete it. But through some linguistic slight-of-hand (i.e., lying) they obscure the fact that your account is not all the data they have on you. Your "account", in a strict sense might just be your username and pas…

>They don't even have to pretend to delete your account, they can actually delete it. But through some linguistic slight-of-hand (i.e., lying) they obscure the fact that your account is not all the data they have on you. Your "account", in a strict sense might just be your username and password. It happens to also be associated with the entire pile of data that is a profile. Once a user no longer has an account, it's what you call a "shadow profile".

A likely scenario. Although I'd say that removing a userid and password from their auth db doesn't qualify as "deleting" an account. Rather, that's disabling an account. And IIUC (I'm not in the EU and not familiar with all the details) the GDPR/EU privacy folks would likely agree with that assessment too.

Perhaps someone with more knowledge of the GDPR could weigh in on what sorts of fines could be levied against Facebook for pulling a stunt like that on European citizens?

Edit: Levied is a more accurate term than "leveled".

Re: How to permanently delete your Facebook account

#265

Post by dahart »

flipbrad wrote: post #257
dahart wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes it can apply to US citizens in certain cases, I thought I agreed with you on that, did I not? It’s still a fact that GDPR does not always (or even normally) apply to US residents doing business with US companies. UK courts have no authority over US companies operating only in the US with US residents who aren’t traveling abroad. Cambridge Analytica is a British company, that is why GDPR applies to them. So yes, I…

The part I most disagreed with is "GDPR is an EU law, it does not apply to US citizens living in the US". Yes it does, I provided an example. Your follow up is a lot closer to the mark.

GDPR is an EU law. It doesn’t automatically apply to people in the US. That’s the only reason I replied - your original framing left an implied suggestion that it might commonly or by default apply to US citizens, without discussing under what conditions. Arguing that you don’t have to be an EU resident leaves the misleading impression that the EU doesn’t have to be involved. I think it’s important to note that the EU part is required somewhere in the company-customer relationship for GDPR to have any say in the matter, and it’s important specifically because this is a common misconception and the misconception is being abused in some cases to coerce compliance where it’s not legally required. I know this as a US business owner that gets emails from US companies on behalf of US citizens that are demanding certain actions and rights under GDPR, without a legal basis to do so.

Re: How to permanently delete your Facebook account

#266

Post by kelnos »

wintermutestwin wrote: post #228
mimentum wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

SMS runs through a different protocol and has different set standards; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SMS iMessage is a proprietary messaging system

Any idea why so many providers charge for SMS?

Simply put, because they can. They may have a monopoly or near-monopoly on SMS service, so they can do what they want.

That was the state of affairs in the US until fairly recently; most carriers (in the US at least) offer a pretty standard plan that includes unlimited texting.

Re: How to permanently delete your Facebook account

#267

Post by kelnos »

nobody9999 wrote: post #138
lopis wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You underestimate the power of convenience. It doesn't bother me much, but I've lost friends because we couldn't keep in touch anywhere other than facebook and whatsapp. Eventually, anyone can stop needing to talk to you.

>You underestimate the power of convenience. It doesn't bother me much, but I've lost friends because we couldn't keep in touch anywhere other than facebook and whatsapp. Eventually, anyone can stop needing to talk to you. Then I guess they weren't very good friends, were they? If they were, they might make an effort, no?

Perhaps not, but often there's value in maintaining casual friendships.

Re: How to permanently delete your Facebook account

#268

Post by freebuju »

xadhominemx wrote: post #168
winternett wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody seems to remember the time back when FaceBook forced everyone on the platform to use their real name... It was exactly the point their plan to gather data matured I believe. This is also why many sites and apps offer verification programs as well in my understanding... Verifying a user's ID has been a practices for ages now, but it did nothing to stop the growth of disinformation because that's not what verifi…

> An unregulated private company asking you for official government documentation and your real name is definitely tracking you in my opinion. This is nothing unusual? It’s extremely common for a private company to request identify verification

There is no legitimate reason for Facebook, or any other social media website, to require a copy of your ID other than for purposes of renting your authentic profile to advertisers.

Re: How to permanently delete your Facebook account

#269

Post by trutannus »

swamp-agr wrote: post #262
trutannus wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a bit hyperbolic, and a little unbelievable. Is it possible that you experienced a bug in Facebook? Or that someone else had access to your account, which prevented the deletion? You've essentially asserted that you've caught Facebook lying about the account deletion process, while not showing us any proof outside of your comment. Not located in US/UK/Europe, however my deleted account is fully deleted. Can't…

Yes, it is possible that I experienced a bug at least three times (2010, 2014 and 2020), certainly. It might be the case, sure. Last email (as of today) about permanent deletion was one year ago. During next year I will give it another try: log in and come back to you, then.

No need to get hostile. You've made an unsubstantiated claim, I'm asking for some proof of which there's still none. Remember, I tried the exact same test with the login as you, and couldn't reproduce.

Like I said, there's a number of reasonable reasons why your account didn't get deleted, all of them pass the Occam's Razor test a little better than "Facebook just didn't delete my account/is not deleting accounts in secret".

You're making a statement which, if true, is huge -- that Facebook is secretly retaining accounts after deletion, despite multiple credible sources (IE: TIME) running detailed articles to the contrary. On top of that your anecdotal evidence is contradicted by my anecdotal evidence. So I hope you understand if I don't take this at face-value.

Re: How to permanently delete your Facebook account

#270

Post by SavantIdiot »

winternett wrote: post #256
SavantIdiot wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We've already agreed in the TOU for our credit cards that the debtor/merchant is entitled to access to information about you from your credit card company. It is far more intrusive than government ID, yet people freak the fuck out about ID but swipe their VISA 10,000 times per second. This is how Scientology tracked me for almost three decades even after I changed addresses a dozen times. I bought something from them…

Credit Card industries are regulated by law, the laws are weak as well though, and also rarely enforced, so card companies can really push boundaries in secretive ways with privacy invasion anyway. In contrast to social media, where there is not any substantial regulation yet, it's the wild west with your information right now... They can sell your phone number, anything saved on your phone, everything you post, and…

> Credit Card industries are regulated by law,

This is a good point. Even though they are ignored, there at least is something to use in litigation.

> and even possibly run a keylogger from their mobile app on your device...

Like the Emoji apps that were doing this years ago.

> instead of installing single-use apps,

I keep my app use extreeeemmely limited.

We need serious regulation on social media sites that collect this much personal information, meaning stuff people post that is intended for a very limited, controlled audience, and not wall posts that are public to everyone. (Like HN.)

I think the problem is what someone pointed out to me yesterday: tying DMs to a "real" identity. Purchases are already tied to who we are, and so are every form we sign that has significance. Phone companies know whos in our address books. Email is 100% insecure, always has been. The last thing to protect is the DMs.... which is probably too late.

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