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Apple and Google must allow other in-app payment systems, Korean law declares

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Re: Apple and Google must allow other in-app payment systems, Korean law declares

#261

Post by fabianhjr »

cletus wrote: post #209

Good. I've been saying this awhile, most notably when Apple (of course followed by Google) introduced a discount on commission for smaller developers. This is completely backwards. I know why they did it. They wanted some positive PR that didn't cost them anything. Thing is, it's the larger publishers who are going to lobby regulators and challenge things in court. It's those same publishers who already have their ow…

> So what Apple/Google should've done is give larger publishers a volume discount. Of course this should force them into binding arbitration and otherwise challenging the discount should void that discount.

Binding arbitration is a uniquely US-legal system thing that is not legal elsewhere. (And imo it is better to have a more neutral third party than an arbitration private firm that has one of the parties as a recurring customer)

Re: Apple and Google must allow other in-app payment systems, Korean law declares

#262

Post by techpression »

I will assume this will end up just how banking regulation ends up, the banks makes the same amount of money (or more) and the loss from regulation is made up somewhere else (higher fees, worse interest rates, etc).

Pay-per-download seems to be a very likely future for apps using external payment systems, free or not (which is only fair, you are after all leeching off the App stores in that scenario), charged by Apple/Google to the developer.

Re: Apple and Google must allow other in-app payment systems, Korean law declares

#263

Post by elefanten »

oceanplexian wrote: post #218
cletus wrote: post #209

Good. I've been saying this awhile, most notably when Apple (of course followed by Google) introduced a discount on commission for smaller developers. This is completely backwards. I know why they did it. They wanted some positive PR that didn't cost them anything. Thing is, it's the larger publishers who are going to lobby regulators and challenge things in court. It's those same publishers who already have their ow…

There’s an entire cottage industry of jailbroken app stores. You might argue that those using alternative stores are a minority (1-5%), but the act of jailbreaking a phone is quite challenging and we still have a lot of people doing it. If iPhones were able to run third party stores I think you’d see 30 or 40% of users opting in to that. Is it a usability nightmare? Perhaps. But device makers shouldn’t make that “cho…

It’s way less than 1%

Waay less.

Re: Apple and Google must allow other in-app payment systems, Korean law declares

#264

Post by mrtksn »

WesolyKubeczek wrote: post #256
mrtksn wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, I can do that. Let's take a look at it: 1) I need to learn and integrate Samsung's API or I need to hire someone to do that for me. I need to maintain a version of the app that works the way Samsung thinks it should(how do you deliver and restore purchases might differ from Apple). 2) Then I need to go through paperwork and payments that will enable me to sell Korea software from UK. I haven't look at the trade…

Well, Korean government is likely to prioritize their local developers. And their darling, Samsung. UK and US have to jump through some hoops, sorry not sorry.

Why not compete on merits instead?

Re: Apple and Google must allow other in-app payment systems, Korean law declares

#265

Post by fabianhjr »

jtbayly wrote: post #228
xdennis wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These companies paying them not to.

So... they are paying money to the government that they aren't required to?

They do that to pay proportionally less (not zero) and the countries they are paying proportionally less to are interested in being the fiscal hosts of those multinationals.

Re: Apple and Google must allow other in-app payment systems, Korean law declares

#267

Post by swiley »

jfoster wrote: post #258

They should unbundle. At the moment, doing business on the app stores entails so many things, but they can break them apart and allow developers to purchase them individually: 1. Put your app on the store. (but only reachable via direct link) 2. Have Gapple verify that your app does not represent any obvious security threat. (or else warn users upon install) 3. Make your app appear in search. (organically) 4. Make yo…

How about getting rid of App Stores altogether unless they follow an f-droid like model? (Selection of alternative repos, Published source, declaring potentially unwanted behavior etc.)

Re: Apple and Google must allow other in-app payment systems, Korean law declares

#268

Post by diebeforei485 »

dmitryminkovsky wrote: post #197
stirlo wrote: post #4

Finally. This is exactly how regulators should respond to the market abuse of these technology monopolies. If they wanted to head this off all they had to do was pay a reasonable amount of tax in the country where the revenue was generated and offer a reasonable (single percentage) fee for facilitating payments. They chose not to so they reap what they sow

I very much agree that this app stores market abuse thing needs to end, and I am also really glad to see that at least one country is responding like this. > a reasonable (single percentage) fee for facilitating payments. I want to point out, though, that the service Apple provides is not merely payment processing. They offer total customer management. Which, when integrated with their entire developer offering (Test…

Stripe Billing[1] only charges 0.5% for this.

Apple's offerings may have been good when the alternative was software sold on physical CD's in a store, but compared to the alternatives today there is no way 30% is by any means fair or reasonable. The 30% commission is essentially monopoly rents.

1. https://stripe.com/billing

Re: Apple and Google must allow other in-app payment systems, Korean law declares

#269

Post by danieldisu »

judge2020 wrote: post #257
ehsankia wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure but the point is that developers should have the option of rolling out their own solution if they don't need all the features Apple provides or agree with the fee. This in turn creates competition which may reduce rates all around.

The common argument against that is that the 30% also goes to actually developing iOS - you could envision the margin Apple makes on every iPhone as one that goes towards the R&D costs of developing the hardware, while the post-sale revenue goes towards the post-sale costs of developing iOS (and all the updates they test/push out for 5+ years after the device is released).

iPhone users pay the development of iOS, iphone users want to use an iPhone in part because all these third party apps.

This is just them wanting more money, and according to latest earnings they already make a lot.

Re: Apple and Google must allow other in-app payment systems, Korean law declares

#270

Post by jollybean »

alberth wrote: post #87

I wonder if Samsung (HQ in Korea) had influence on this requirement. EDIT: why the downvotes? If you don’t think Samsung had influence, wouldn’t it be more productive to reply and say so - that way there can be a healthy dialogue on the topic.

You are being downvoted because you went against the populist grain of the thread, that's it. Accept that a lot of HN voting is just 'sided' and if you're on the wrong side of the flow ... that's it.

Just take a moment to reflect on your comments, if they are reasonable and you're getting downvoted, and nobody is bothering to respond, it's probably populism. It it was it is, it's too bad, but don't fret about it.

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