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Firefox 90

mozilla.org

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Re: Firefox 90

#261

Post by 40four »

berniemadoff69 wrote: post #168
40four wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That doesn’t mean anything. It’s a tired attack that gets repeated over and over, but has nothing to do with the values and goals Mozilla/ Firefox represent.

I think if I learned Greenpeace was single-handedly funded by Exxon, my reaction wouldn't be to say 'that doesnt mean anything'

I think this a logic fallacy. It’s a false/ incomplete comparison.

Mozilla is not an advertising company. They have no incentive to track users or invade privacy. Their whole ethos as a company is pro-privacy obviously.

Yes, they take take money from Google to make them the default search engine on a fresh Firefox install. They are a big company with lots of employees (less as of recently) that need to be paid, and they don’t really have any products that generate large amount of income.

Seems like a small price to pay if you ask me. I’ve never heard anyone who throws out the ‘Mozilla takes Google money’ criticism back it up with why that somehow compromises Firefox as a browser.

Re: Firefox 90

#262

Post by floatingatoll »

downWidOutaFite wrote: post #188
ergot_vacation wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The general mass of humanity never does things because they're "right": Ethical, Forward-Thinking, Better For Society etc. They do them because they're easy. To the extent that wide social change ever happens, it only happens because the path of least resistance shifted from one thing to another. If you despair for the actions of the masses, never try to reason with them. Skip straight to assembling a good marketing…

I sense some cognitive dissonance between your two paragraphs. In the first you argue for a focus on consumerism and marketing, in the second you criticize Firefox for competing by appealing to styles and trends.

Do you feel that this dissonance should change how we readers interpret this argument in some way, or is this meant solely as a typo-fix kind of comment? It’s unusual to see a new HN user offering proofreading comments, so I’m hesitant to accept that interpretation without checking first.

Re: Firefox 90

#263

Post by atatatat »

twelvechairs wrote: post #253
xpressvideoz wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The time I lost my faith in Firefox was when the CEO of Mozilla got a huge pay increase, whilst firing many technical people at the same time. How can a tech company improve their product without those technical people? Oh, never mention the ever-decreasing number of Firefox users. Weren't the C-level people responsible for that? Anyway, that was the moment when I realized Mozilla was just another company, not a flag…

So whats the better, more ethical alternative? Certainly not Chrome

Edge

Re: Firefox 90

#264

Post by Tagbert »

Scarbutt wrote: post #137

Is there a plugin that imitates Chrome's tab groups? I tried tree style tab but it's not the same.

I don’t know about Chrome tab groups, but I use the Panorama FF plugin for tab groups.

I gives a virtual page that you can add group containers and put tabs in them. When you switch groups, the tabs in the window switch to those tabs. I setup groups for each of my projects and this lets me switch project contexts quickly.

Re: Firefox 90

#266

Post by rd07 »

jimbob45 wrote: post #237
bergheim wrote: post #122

I think Firefox news is what I comment most on here. I don't know why. Well I guess I do. Web browsers, javascript etc is front and center here - which somewhat means the digital world. All my friends use Chrome, and think I'm weird. I think _they_ are. They care about human rights, at least I think they do. But, having Google, an ad company, dictate how our window to the digital world looks like, is now _way worse_…

> All my friends use Chrome I’m guessing 99% of the users of this site use Chrome…Dev Tools. The real question is what people use for personal browsing after hours. I wish Mozilla would just import Chrome’s Dev Tools because they’re just undeniably better than anything else on the market.

I have been a long time user of Firefox, but as a web developer I use Chromium occasionally to test a web application I develop. I would like to know, what kind of feature that Chrome/Chromium dev tools offer that Firefox doesn't?

Re: Firefox 90

#267

Post by zarzavat »

fleddr wrote: post #216
zarzavat wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firefox needs to become the default browser for web developers. They need to go all-in on developer tooling. The manifest v3 issue may help by poaching technical users from chrome. They also need to stop being so "principled" about features such as WebMidi. If I have to keep another browser around certain websites that Firefox is too principled to support then why bother using Firefox at all.

They can't out engineer Google on dev tooling, or the dev ecosystem. They just don't have the resources. Chrome dev tools is vast and very rapidly evolving. Google has large evangelists teams dedicated to explaining dev tools or web tech in general. They are everywhere, on Twitter, Youtube, blogs, conferences, in web standards proposals. It's Google all the way down. If I'm not mistaken, Mozilla doesn't even have any…

Yet I still use Mozilla MDN far more than all of those google resources put together. They're not dead yet.

Re: Firefox 90

#268

Post by atatatat »

411111111111111 wrote: post #129
bergheim wrote: post #122

I think Firefox news is what I comment most on here. I don't know why. Well I guess I do. Web browsers, javascript etc is front and center here - which somewhat means the digital world. All my friends use Chrome, and think I'm weird. I think _they_ are. They care about human rights, at least I think they do. But, having Google, an ad company, dictate how our window to the digital world looks like, is now _way worse_…

Just remember that Mozilla gets over 90% of its revenue from Google.

Exactly.

Come back when your "team" is not taking hundreds of millions to put out a consistently less-secure browser based on an engine nobody backs.

If anyone wants the free internet, fork Chromium and at least don't start a mile behind when security is what's at stake — like Microsoft did.

Re: Firefox 90

#269

Post by atatatat »

40four wrote: post #261
berniemadoff69 wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think if I learned Greenpeace was single-handedly funded by Exxon, my reaction wouldn't be to say 'that doesnt mean anything'

I think this a logic fallacy. It’s a false/ incomplete comparison. Mozilla is not an advertising company. They have no incentive to track users or invade privacy. Their whole ethos as a company is pro-privacy obviously. Yes, they take take money from Google to make them the default search engine on a fresh Firefox install. They are a big company with lots of employees (less as of recently) that need to be paid, and t…

> they take take money from Google to make them the default search engine on a fresh Firefox install.

Heh, no.

They take money from Google to get paid and also help Google avoid antitrust suits.

Re: Firefox 90

#270

Post by dannyw »

floatingatoll wrote: post #262
downWidOutaFite wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I sense some cognitive dissonance between your two paragraphs. In the first you argue for a focus on consumerism and marketing, in the second you criticize Firefox for competing by appealing to styles and trends.

Do you feel that this dissonance should change how we readers interpret this argument in some way, or is this meant solely as a typo-fix kind of comment? It’s unusual to see a new HN user offering proofreading comments, so I’m hesitant to accept that interpretation without checking first.

Not sure what the meaning behind your comment, but I found /u/downWidOutaFite's reply to be thought provoking.

Specifically, the original poster's paragraphs seem to contradict each other: the first suggests 'not fighting the good fight' because you have to appeal to consumerism, and the second blames Mozilla for not fighting the good fight and appealing to consumerism.

I also don't know why the account age has anything to do with this -- they're not pointing out a typo, they're pointing out a logical contradiction.

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